The World in 2036: Nassim Taleb looks at what will break, and what won't (2010)
economist.com
economist.com
If I like Taleb, who else should be reading?
Then I'd say reading history and trying to imagine how those people thought like. I think Taleb is basically a historian that happened to trade a lot of options in his past life. I like Robert Shiller's idea of "moving back in time", where you read today's NYTimes daily but from say, 1925, instead of 2020.
Also, here is a list of authors Taleb himself considers to be, in classic Taleb fashion, "non BS vendors":
Considering basically nothing he talks about is a thought original to him, I can't say I agree. He's good at popularizing things with the general public that were already well known within specialist circles, though.
He's also quite spotty on a bunch of science related subjects, including GMOs
We have always been over our head. And you don't have to be a "Monsanto shill" to realize that.
He's very trigger happy with the block button, which ironically limits his exposure to contrarian views and likely makes his ideas less anti-fragile in the long run.
From everything I have read about Monsanto (none of it from Taleb), they are a pretty shitty, unethical company. They have ruined the lives of farmer in many places inside and out outside the US. I mean, round up is illegal in the EU.
His issue with GMOs, as I understand it, is mother nature "developed" and evolved these crops over a long period of time, and we should not trust a few IYI scientists at Monsanto, etc to play with that evolution via genetic manipulation.
There are many many examples of GMO foods that we all eat every day that are not related to the genetic modification done to make plants able to handle having roundup sprayed on them. I had some papayas over the weekend - something like 4/5ths of all papayas in the US are GMO because the ringspot virus nearly wiped them out prior to scientists genetically modifying them.
Taleb basically sticks his head in the sand and acts like Monsanto is the only game in town when it comes to GMOs and thinks that it is too dangerous for us to do at all.
> mother nature "developed" and evolved these crops over a long period of time, and we should not trust a few IYI scientists at Monsanto, etc to play with that evolution via genetic manipulation
We evolved sleeping on the earth, but very few treat that as an argument against beds.
That is a flagrant abuse of the phrase "by definition"! Who is Vallianatos and on what basis does he make these claims? I looked him up and found that he has a BA in zoology and a doctorate in history, so I'd be keen to look at original sources rather than treat him as an expert.
He's obviously important in general - I just think there's probably a better label thank thinker. Evangelist, maybe?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/profile/amzn1.account.AHMHNR4MRTDL...
But Read (or re-read) Fooled by Randomness with a notepad handy and note down any author he recommends and that should answer your question.
I wonder about this aspect of his personality. For instance, if I knew gravity = 9.8 m/s^2 and everyone around me still thought the earth was flat, would the daily interactions with people start to grate on me? Probably.
Of course, if I really thought I knew, but was wrong, then I'd just be an idiot & a jerk.
Seriously though, what if he's completely right about something that other people don't see? Then is he really being a dick, or is everyone else being one for calling him that and not seeing the same answers he sees?
It's got to be hard to know something that nobody else does and still be patient with everyone while they question you incessantly.
A good proxy for me is being a parent and trying to explain something for the umpteenth time to my kid - it get frustrating at times.
If you have a decent amount of humility and good will, I honestly think you'd settle into working on finding the best way to communicate your ideas without belittling people.
The great things about kids is that they grow, and you are explaining new things to them over the years, not the same thing for 20 years.
EDIT - just to clarify my original comment, I was not excusing his behavior - only pondering the source of it.
Ole Peters work on ergodocity
Paul Skallas / "Lindy Table" on Twitter
That, and of course he also wrote a take-down of IQ (and psychology in general) that pissed off a lot of IQ-fetishists on here.
He also made a bunch of money, knows a lot of advanced and ultrarigorous (read: French-educated) math and reads in a bunch of languages so even though he's a colossal asshole no one can exactly dismiss him as a hack, so he just kind of sticks there like an annoying wart in the face of "the discourse" that just won't go away. Personally, and in case it wasn't obvious, I sort of like him.
Edit: I forgot to mention he sometimes blocks people who give the wrong answer to the integral solving problems he posts on Twitter. I don't expect you to understand but I really respect that.
I also don't know about him attacking Dawkins' math; I don't know of any significant math Dawkins has ever published. You may be referring to Taleb's defence of E.O. Wilson, Nowak et al [2], which was attacked by Dawkins and Steven Pinker, without disproving the math in the paper, which Taleb claims to have verified.
[1] https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1177630356327075841
[2] https://www.facebook.com/nntaleb/posts/eo-wilson-nowak-et-al...
Interesting, can you mention by chance what major data points you see that are suggesting this? Thanks.
Specifically on major data points, FT writes “if foreigners want to hold American liquid assets in vast amounts, the US must run a huge external deficit, unless its private sector wishes to load itself up with riskier foreign assets on a comparable scale“ which doesn’t seem very sustainable in longer term. (We’re operating in the current system effectively since 1971.)
(The piece further mentions the possibility of the current system “destroying the open world economy” which does indeed seem a bit gloomy.)
(It doesn’t look very good for Euro either: https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2020-06-22/ecb-l... )
Taleb’s point has consistently been that one must focus on the impact rather than the event (the nonlinearity of that map is often the source of fat tails).
It doesn’t matter if a lot of small family-owned businesses fail. In the short term (months-years) it will be painful, but can be weathered easily with some government support and start thriving on the 2-3 year time scale. Small entities are naturally nimble.
The failure of numerous large and highly-leveraged businesses has a very different kind of impact because of the ripple effects that might cause serious systemic damage.
Tell that to the families involved.
> https://twitter.com/nntaleb/status/1204827396999929857
Last time I checked, Taleb lives in NYC. Surprise! That's where the "doom" will happen once the USD is hyper-inflated and the USA is bankrupt. Someone is not following his own advice.
I'd also bet that Taleb is using in his daily-life more big corp products than small-family owned ones. I'm really wondering where this cognitive dissonance is coming from since many "high-profile" people seem to be suffering from it.
Some reasons Taleb comes off as so intransigent and just obstinate in real-life is two fold -
1) He sees as profoundly evil the privatization of profits and socialization of risks (banks) and sees "no consequence" professions - economists, experts, bureaucrats, war mongers, politicians and intellectuals as deeply unethical and predatory.
2) He went through a phase which he talks about in Anti Fragile, after the publication of Black Swan that he actually had to get security and was broadly shunned by the financial and intellectual elite which went against them. He is also independently wealthy and has learnt to inoculate himself to the circular congratulatory world of honors, awards, citations etc.
Taleb has been right about a lot of things and obviously wrong about few. However that is a difficult yardstick to measure on when the events he is talking about unfold once every 100 years or longer. It takes immense courage to make a stand on things that might never happen in your lifetime. For example he has been talking about the risks of pandemics for years and wrote a very prescient piece on Covid-19 in Jan. Now, China could have very well stopped Covid-19 in its tracks like they did SARs and we would have been spared and he would have looked like a fear monger. However it was the right call for Taleb to make and that is true courage.
I began reading Taleb when Fooled by Randomness came out in the early 200s. Read The Black Swan and then stopped because I did not find his work prescriptive. Recently got through the rest of his books and wished I had read them much much earlier. Now I plan to re-read them every two years.
Most intellectuals, including the general population of HN, have an almost allergic reaction to Taleb. They find him pompous, insufferable, unscientific, unoriginal and the rest. To each his own but it would behoove anyone who generally cares about how the world works to give the Incerto a read with an open mind.
BTW he is hugely bullish on the value of startups to both individuals and society (Anti-Fragile and Skin In the Game).
Taleb is one of the most frequently positively cited public intellectuals on HN.
Certainly, there are also negative reactions to him, but claiming the general population of HN has an “almost allergic reaction” to Taken is a ridiculously hyperbolic display of “my preferred viewpoint is persecuted here.”
This here is crucial. Investment in capitalism resolves around predicting future profits and committing yourself to those predictions via debt and leverage. However, the heavier your commitments or the further the future swings from your predictions, the more of today's production you've wastefully dumped into a hole.
I haven't read The End of Alchemy, but Taleb also doesn't even think modelling black swan events is possible or even useful. Any attempts that claims can predict black swan events is assumed as harmful. And he would also propose the same to build greater buffers into assumptions or even assume that it will fail in time. Antifragile is the book that explores this more on how fragile are predictions and it's far more useful to know where is the risk exposure and compensate for that instead of calculating the risk and trying to avoid it.
Can you imagine how beautiful that is? When I'm bored, I take a look at his twitter account and get inspired by things I would hardly find elsewhere.
Ah, on the inequality part: you would deserve a proper explanation, but in summary: I'm Italian, living in San Francisco for the past decade; when he says there's more inequality in Florence than in the US, I have a deep gut feeling that he's completely wrong. I know Florence and I know San Francisco, in terms of inequality I would always pick Florence (in terms of being a fairer system). I just need to pick outside my window to see several homeless people, and that's only scratching the surface.
[0]: https://medium.com/incerto/inequality-and-skin-in-the-game-d...
Insecurity is the problem. People in Florence are secure (their basic needs are met), while SF has an open defecation problem.
The point is while "technically" (via some precise mathematical measure involving the entire wealth or income distribution) the inequality may be huge, if you can feel safe you'll not be very angry. "Safety" involves really basic things: shelter, healthcare, food, social purpose.
> The great top-down nation-state will be only cosmetically alive, weakened by deficits, politicians' misalignment of interests and the magnification of errors by centralised systems. The pre-modernist robust model of city-states and statelings will prevail, with obsessive fiscal prudence.
1. So far, NOT TRUE. Nation-states still dominate the global landscape, and a majority have annual budget deficits (i.e., there is no "fiscal prudence").
> Currencies might still exist, but, after the disastrous experience of America's Federal Reserve, they will peg to some currency without a government, such as gold.
2. So far, NOT TRUE. AFAIK, no national currencies are pegged to gold nor to some other "currency without a government". Currencies created by government fiat dominate.
> Companies that are currently large, debt-laden, listed on an exchange (hence “efficient”) and paying bonuses will be gone. Those that will survive will be the more black swan-resistant—smaller, family-owned, unlisted on exchanges and free of debt. There will be large companies then, but these will be new—and short-lived.
3. So far, NOT TRUE. Most companies that are large, debt-laden, and exchange-traded are still around in their current form, though many have been supported by government largesse during the covid-19 pandemic.
> Most of the technologies that are now 25 years old or more will be around; almost all of the younger ones “providing efficiencies” will be gone, either supplanted by competing ones or progressively replaced by the more robust archaic ones. So the car, the plane, the bicycle, the voice-only telephone, the espresso machine and, luckily, the wall-to-wall bookshelf will still be with us.
4. So far, TRUE.
> The world will face severe biological and electronic pandemics, another gift from globalisation.
5. TRUE on the biological front!!!
6. So far, NOT TRUE on the electronic front.
> Religious practice will experience a revival, seen as a conveyor of robust heuristics, cultural values and rituals.
7. So far, NOT TRUE. See, for example: https://www.pewforum.org/2019/10/17/in-u-s-decline-of-christ...
> Science will produce smaller and smaller gains in the non-linear domain, in spite of the enormous resources it will consume; instead it will start focusing on what it cannot—and should not—do.
8. So far... MAYBE? I mean, we have seen remarkable advances in AI (vision, NLP, speech, etc.), distributed systems (e.g., blockchains), quantum computing (Google, IBM, others), space exploration (Tesla, Blue Origin, others), green energy (Tesla again)... I'm inclined to say, as of yet, NOT TRUE.
> Finally, what is now called academic economics will be treated with the same disrespect that rigorous (and practical) minds currently have for Derrida-style post-modernist verbiage.
9. So far, NOT TRUE. Academic economists still seem to be treated with about as much respect as in 2010.
We know COVID exists; idiots argue about it on the street.
I don't think people realize how much propaganda and marketing dominate all facets of discourse. There is an electronic pandemic, and it's in your feed every day.
I just think the worst case here we're really going towards Dystopian Sci-Fi "one world government and super corporations" rather than city states.
https://www.amazon.com/review/R1GJ1RXSS8ZXME/
and it made me think of how it applies to software development:
https://henrikwarne.com/2014/06/08/antifragility-and-softwar...
I read his entire Incerto, and it was an absolute slog. Endless chapters just about how he's smarter than other Wall Street guys. Antifragile is probably the best book in the series, but the concept itself could be relegated to an essay -- not a whole book. As far as the article itself is concerned, it's typical doomerism. His entire post-Wall Street career revolves around doom and gloom (his main claim to fame being "black swan" events), so of course it makes sense that, from a Talebian perspective, the world will end by 2035.
Becoming a millionaire isn't like winning the lottery. For those who achieve it through passion & work, they are self-selectively not the people who will wake up one morning and "go fishing".
Don't kid yourself. Risk is risk. The only inevitability is death. (Remember when that used to be "Death and Taxes." We should go back to when taxes were in that list).
A lottery requires no specific sort of character. Making a million, often, does.
The sort of determined character that isn't going to wake up one morning and "stop doing what made them rich". Because it was never about being rich, it was always about what they were doing.
It's why Jerry Seinfeld, a billionaire, continues to do stand up. He's on stage for netflix, not "fishing".
It sucks that there's not much "justice" in getting hugely rich but the fact remains. All kinds of folks get there. All kinds don't. Some work hard. Some just fail upwards. Don't fall for the cherry picked BS of "which of you sublime charter traits ensured your success" It's crap and it smells bad too.
"Get up early. Strike oil." Doesn't matter what style of person you are.
Don't fall for the leftwing resentiment of hating the rich either.
The reality is that there's huge amounts of social mobility across all wealth brackets, and enmass, those moving in/out of the top 5% do have quite reliable characteristics.
Eg., of the "top 1%" almost everyone in that class is only it in for, on average, 9mo in their entire lifetime. The risk-taking needed to get you there, equally, knocks you out.
The reality of a functioning economy is that a certain kind of "competence" (even if its psychopathic) is selected for. Regardless of the handful of celebrities and strike-it-rich anecdotes you can analyse in tabloid fashion.
The comment i was replying to expressed surprise that a rich person would be doing anything other than wasting time on a holiday: thus they express their (relative) poverty. Very few rich people would find it remarkable they weren't wasting time: that is precisely what they have never done.
That is /exactly/ what I'm disputing. To the point where you can't even generalise about so-called "self-made" rich people.
But beyond that, I'm not left-wing. At all. There's nothing left-wing about being a bit contemptuous of the successful who believe their monetary success is proof of themselves as superior humans. And there are at least some successful people who agree with that. Takes all kinds. Some fail upwards.
I'm not saying anyone deserves anything. I'm not saying anyone is superior.
I'm saying that commonly, amongst people who become millionaires, you find a certain set of characteristics.
In particular, you often find an obsessive interest in something which is greater than their desire to vacation or to spend frivolously: typically their business.
Poorer people misunderstand wealth. To them it is essentially just a series of inexplicable lotteries, "falling up" as you say.
But in functioning societies most people who become wealth don't just "fall up" -- there is a pattern to their personality (including risk tasking, say) which facilitates this movement.
I continue to disagree strongly with this. There are /all/ kinds.
We're now talking past each other. Some are successful for reasons one can attribute to their nature. Some just fail upwards. Really they do. It's actually hard to miss examples of this when you look a little critically. I'm not sure how you've come to the conclusion such people don't exist... Luck is always a huuuge factor, even among the best of us. Anyway, best.
vapid - offering nothing that is stimulating or challenging.
I'm curious how you have evaluated JBP to be vapid, could you provide some details of your analysis?my problem with JBP is that he presents his ideas as facts but they are nothing more than pseudo science and cherry picking to fit his narrative (e.g. he hasn't really understood the Jungian archetypes and keeps waffling on about it with great confidence). He seems to fit very well into Alan Sokal's definition of the "intellectual imposter". (the irony here is that Sokal himself hasn't understood postmodernism lol)
All Jungian psychology is pseudoscience; hell most psychology is pseudoscience outside of measurable behaviorist or cognitive approaches.
The thing people miss is there are a lot of people out there who haven't been exposed to such ideas.
I do think he got too big too fast and wasn't really ready to be a cultural icon like he became.
I think him and NN Taleb are on similar footing when it comes to the quality of their thought though. Both are interesting, but the well isn't very deep and you'll have to move on to something new before long.
Every single idea he has is conservative orthodoxy of one kind or another. Nobody living in the Western world has been spared exposure to the ideas he is so in love with. He is just good at failing to explaining them while being as un-concise as possible.
If that were the case, he wouldn't have the massive following he does.
His followers follow him because he reinforces existing points of view. Nothing wrong with that, just saying that having such following doesn't imply original ideas.
I recommend the "what is true?" making sense podcast episode (https://samharris.org/podcasts/what-is-true/). It helped me better understand Peterson outside of the spotlight generated by him touching the controversial topics if our society. My opinion on him after that interview is even less flattering: he seemed interested in bending terminology and logic itself for the benefit of crafting a worldview he deems innate to humans, instead of researching our nature though inquiry. The feeling I got was that of an erudite anti-scientist.
In particular, the anecdote about how Peterson wanted to be a preacher.
Where might a person acquire such knowledge? It implies that someone would have had to compile all of JP's ideas, and then compare it against the knowledge of all Westen people. That sounds like quite an undertaking.
Nice weather, but not much fish. https://eu.oceana.org/en/press-center/press-releases/un-aler...
Case in point, here we are.
With money and notoriety, he can flex that love of argument all he wants without having to worry about upsetting his masters.
JBP is a rehash of 1990's Heritage Foundation whitepapers. He's a good speaker, but there is no new ground there; Talib at least can hold some water with Black Swan and Fooled By Randomness.
So I guess the answer is to block JavaScript and cookies