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Comment by code_duck | Hacker News Reader

Unfortunately, the way the 'market figures it out' involves thousands of people dying in order to get the point across to 'the market'.

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Godwin's Law, HackerNews edition: as a non-tech policy discussion grows longer, the probability of a comment thread devolving into an argument between competing ideas of libertarian vs. interventionist market theologies approaches 1.

Well, that's kind of the underlying point of the article and the discussion around it.

Agreed, I was just trying to jocularly comment on the Things That Don't Exactly Belong On Hacker News aspect of it by pointing out that those conversations always end up in the same place.

And, in addition, these conversations tend to be rather shallow and un-anchored by fact. More an exhibition case for general philosophical predilections than a serious examination of the particular policy issue.

The tendency to degenerate into arguments over libertarianism predates Hacker News. Ron(?) Newman proposed it as “Newman’s Corollary to Godwin’s Law” over ten years ago.

Do you suppose that the government anticipated the need for building codes before anybody ever died?

There's a saying that the fire code is written in blood. Generally, most of the regulations are there because when they weren't, it resulted in some disaster that cost lives. If it didn't, there wouldn't be the political will to incur greater cost and complexity in construction.

That doesn't mean that the codes shouldn't be updated / refactored once in a while, but that's a pretty difficult thing to undertake, and there may not be political will...

I can't tell what rhetorical position you're trying to take, but I suspect, from my knowledge of building practices and codes in Richmond, Indiana from the 19th century to today, that the answer is that no, the government did not regulate building before it became all too clear that building needed to be regulated. All our old houses here are built like Sherman tanks - but that's because the ones that weren't built like Sherman tanks are long decayed and gone, and in some cases burned to the ground with loss of all on board. Electrification took a lot of people by surprise. I have some pretty horrible wiring in the attic myself (not live, though).

I've done some renovation work on old buildings. I recommend removing ALL of the old wire. There's nothing like looking at a shabby old wire and wondering if it is hot or not. Even worse, sometimes an idiot will try to reconnect that old wire, yes, I've seen them try it.

Rip all of it out.

Oh, it's on the list, trust me. I've got fossil infrastructure in here over a hundred years old - in a way I feel like I should get some archaeologists in to catalog it before I get it all out.

The scary thing is that the basement lights are still on the old wiring - roughly 1920's vintage. Fortunately, no gaslights left, although I do have one fitting in the upstairs sitting room!

You mean like the people who died to instigate those very building codes?

Sure... so who reacted first, the government or the capitalists?

Considering how many codes (building codes, health codes, etc.) started out as efforts in the private sector by the likes of insurance companies and restaurant reviewers, it seems that answer is would be the capitalists, most of the time.

So, if the government removed those legal restrictions, do you think those industries would move to make their operations more safe, or less expensive for themselves in the short term?

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