Hacker News Reader

Comment by ct520 | Hacker News Reader

And yet many of us will still buy the next macbook pro 13inch refresh when it comes out with a "good keyboard" and a substandard processor. Why is that? For me - its the total package. The software/the hardware/integrations that just work/the arguably best track pad in the industry.

CPU is one piece to the puzzle. I read on the message board to unlock the top tier AMD mobile processors you had to guarantee it wouldn't be paired with other crap hardware like vendors done in the past. We will see - hopefully next microsoft refresh breaks this trend for amd.

View on HN

I'm not sure I follow what you're trying to communicate. It's true that if you only consider an Apple laptop, you will only consider an Apple laptop. Windows laptops compete against each other. Few people cross shop them. That being said, it seems that 75-80% of personal computers sold today are still running Windows, not OS X. As someone that has software that runs equally well on Windows and OS X, and who does not use a track pad, bang for buck on hardware performance and quality (and minimal OEM meddling) sells me my laptop.

It's also true that AMD has an uphill battle with convincing OEMs to make really great laptops using their APUs. But one would suspect that reading this article, you can tell that Asus has at least a foot in the door, as this is a review of a very high quality laptop - the whole package, not just the CPU.

And finally, it's of course also true that most Microsoft Surface products use Intel chips, with just one version of the Surface Laptop using an AMD chip. But they already began to buy into AMD hardware, so I would expect more along those lines this fall!

I'm was making an assertion that I feel that a lot of people will buy apple while having a substandard product in some aspects. Because overall it has the "package" When i refer to "many of us" I was talking about startups/developer community maybe not super enterprise-y like a Freddie or Fannie/ BofA etc.

"Why is that?" was a question. I answered it for me, but I was wondering for others. That may buy a macbook over something with arguably notebooks with better cpus / configuration. Why are they doing it?

AMD has a great processor, what they need is a great platform. I hope Microsoft partnership they have pushes them forward. Because I'm tired of buying intel macbooks/notebooks

I've owned/used lots of laptops (both my own & from work).

When I tried windows laptops in recent times I searched for the best ones in my size range - both times they were dells (last one is a 2015 XPS 13) & in both I've paid close to apple-level prices (the xps was €2400 IIRC) and yet I had to have both repaired within about a year of buying. With the xps it was just after the 1 year mark which meant I had to pay several €100s for a screen replacement.

This never happened to me with a MacBook pro despite having used a lot more of these than I have PC laptops (which were supposed to be high-end laptops).

For what it's worth I don't care about OS - my main computer is an iMac I duelboot Mac & Win via boot camp.

This is anecdotal. The last macbook I bought the GPU stopped working and it black screened after 2 years or so. It was also ran hot due to apple's weird indexers constantly using 100% cpus in the background and it being a closed system meant you couldn't really figure out wtf it was doing that or fix it.

However my 2012 era thinkpad is a complete tank, and even better any issues are easily user serviceable.

Yeah I had a company issued 2019 top of the line xps 15. It replaced top of the line HP 5 years back. I would commute a lot and bring my macbook to use in place of the dell. I would dual boot i. I only take out the XPS to get on vpn :-/

Windows has plenty of developer community to keep the 80% market share customers happy with applications and games.

I personally have never seen a "windows" developer do any development work on a windows laptop (I see they have visual studio etc installed). Unless you counting documentation / requirements. I have seen a lot of ix devs and osx developers develop on their laptops. I work as a consultant in big enterprise world and with many startups on a range of projects.

I have seen plenty of them in the last 30 years, specially since 2006 doing consulting for Fortune 500, where docking station/thinkpad combos are pretty much standard.

A very famous Finish telecommunication company, several well known German companies in medicament production and life sciences domains, and a couple of car and package delivery companies.

Anecdotes.

Ahhhhh!!! You are correct the docking station. I ment being mobile and doing work. Most definety. I see more devs with docking stations then Apple / Linux combined. I just never seen them used it undocked for dev though lol. Great point!

I may well end up buying it to replace my aging Macbook Pro, but it will be because the cost of switching to Windows is too high, and because there is proprietary software I need that won't run on Linux.

I am buying it because I have little choice, not because it represents good value or the "total package". Few ports, bad repairability, and an OS that won't run perfectly good 32-bit applications.

A good alternative to this is to run Linux and use Windows in a VM if necessary. Having to use a VM for something once in a while is mildly inconvenient, but it's not that bad, and on the other hand it's just bad enough to keep you on the lookout for ways to stop using it entirely.

> use Windows in a VM if necessary

That's my last vestige of Windows usage, and by the end of the coming weekend I'm hoping not to need that VM very often either.

My only other occasional need to use Windows tends to, ironically, revolve around the software needed to root some Android phones.

Interesting. I'm not stuck on OSX ecosystem as much as you but certain things do turn me off. I'm really in love with the trackpad and for the most part overall build quality. (my daily is still a macbook pro retina late 2013). I would love to make jump to linux but traditionally battery life the hardware options i have not been in love with. :(

I have a feeling a lot of comments here are missing one thing which is huge for me: MacOS has a consistent UI across all applications.

Last year I decided to switch to a Thinkpad with Ubuntu, and while I can work on it, and it kind of has replacements for everything I am used to on Mac, not only the quality of such replacements is usually lower (Good luck finding an equal alternative to iTerm2 or Alfred) but also the shortcuts and UI elements differ from application to application, and it bothers me a lot. I am certainly buying the upcoming Macbook, even though it's probably going to be based on an average (compared to this AMD), highly throttled Intel processor. Am I happy about it? No! But for my usage, it's the best trade-off as of now.

>MacOS has a consistent UI across all applications

Let's see my currently running apps :

Chrome - no

Firefox - no

Slack - no

intellij IDEs - no

VSCode - no

Spotify - maybe kinda sortof ?

VLC - no

WhatsApp - no

Telegram - no

Steam - no

What is this consistent UI you speak of ? Most of these apps look the same on windows.

The only reason I own a MacBook is because I wanted a single device and I occasionally need to do some osx/iOS work - would be happier with windows laptop for sure

The problem with Windows 10 is that it doesn't have consistent UI across applications from MS, bundled with system. Heck, there is even 3 or 4 different styles for context menu. They are trying to roll out Fluent Design for what, 3 years now? New control panel is also kinda laughable functionality wise. And I write it as W10 user.

Like Apple when it was transitioning from Aqua into more Metallic look, followed by Skeuomorphism and now everything should be Dark?

How about just the following:

Cmd + q, Cmd + `, Cmd + p, Cmd + shift + 4

If I could do this easily these things on Windows in every application, it would be a great start. I have to use Mac and Windows for work and I still think that Mac gets in your way less than Windows do.

Alt+f4, install greenshot for screens - it's better than osx screengrab - don't know what the middle two do

Just to make sure I understand you, I need to install something to have great UX on Windows? You see how quickly we getting there, default UX on Windows is crap but you can install x,y,z. This is exactly why I use MacOS because I am tired of tracking what exactly is doing those things I (and many other people) need on a daily basis on Windows.

So where is a calendar widget in the OSX that allows me to see my events when I click on it ? Why do I have to install itsycal when windows has it built in to the os date time widget which is superior to OSX ?

It's a ridiculous argument and I don't see why screen capture should be a part of the OS other than you expect it from OSX.

Besides the UX of OSX screen capture is inferior compared to Greenshot - much easier to determine the capture target and way more options - I don't want to spam my desktop with screenshots.

It might be the total package or it might be inertia. While Apple had a head start on polished hardware, all of the producers are catching on in some ways.

If you can do your work on another OS (and, generally, you can but habits are strong and you are just so used with your favourite brand) then another laptop doesn't seem so far fetched.

I think this is getting closer to the truth. We are creatures of habit and staying with Apple feels cozy.

> I read on the message board to unlock the top tier AMD mobile processors you had to guarantee it wouldn't be paired with other crap hardware like vendors done in the past.

Crap HW (utterly terrible keyboards) don't seem to have stalled Apple's Macbook sales though.

I think what makes this inherently harder with notebooks is that everything is integrated. It's not like you can decide to upgrade the keyboard or screen if you don't like the one it comes with. As a result, you're constrained by the whims of the manufacturer.

Here's hoping somebody builds a laptop with one of these CPUs that has good battery life, is quiet under light load, has upgradeable memory/storage and comes with a good 16:10 screen.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com