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Comment by ryandrake | Hacker News Reader

You don’t need to teach them about inspect element. You just need to teach them today’s basic rule of thumb: if someone contacts you over the phone or Internet asking you to do something, no matter what it is or how serious the person sounds... just don’t do it.

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Bank branches mostly exist as an anti-fraud device for mortals.

The lesson is, someone call tell you there IS a problem on the phone, but don't trust ANYTHING else, not even the description of the problem.

The absolute only thing they're allowed to tell you is that you need to visit your banking provider tomorrow, not some other bank but your own bank, with only family, and ask what the actual problem is.

Your suggestion, while well intentioned, does not fully appreciate the scope of the problem as it relates to elderly social engineering and the inherent weaknesses (fear, loneliness, mental deterioration) that are leveraged by attackers.

This. Loneliness is powerful; I suspect that if you're lonely enough, even a scam call conversation has appeal. There are even suggestions that loneliness has physical implications [0].

My father suffers from vascular dementia. He's pretty agreeable these days (a lot more so than he used to be). Fortunately an underlying suspicion of strangers calling to talk about money on the telephone has triumphed thus far, but I do expect that this balance will change over time.

[0] https://www.nia.nih.gov/news/social-isolation-loneliness-old...

I've legitimately lost a credit card and had my bank call me about fraudulent transactions. I didn't know the card was missing until they called.

To expand on the banking scenario: If you get a call about a stolen/lost credit card don't call the number back (or use a number the caller provides.)

Instead lookup the fraud/accounts contact number for the bank and call them yourself. - aka start the interaction with known good information

Unfortunately there's a scam for that,apparently. The scam caller tells the victim to call their bank, but doesn't hang up. The victim hangs up, calls the bank, the scammer is still on the line.

If you're concerned about that, wait a minute. I can't find any discussion of the scam online, but I would hazard a guess that this isn't really an attack vector these days.

It happened to an old lady in switzerland recently - she didn't hang up, the scammer just got quiet after saying he would hang up so she could call the police, and then had someone else answer the lady when she assumed she was talking to the police.

how is this allowed to be a thing?

The telco's themselves should be held legally responsible for the fraud in these cases.

If I hang up a phone, I expect that to be the end of it, period. Yes, that includes landlines.

..and for those who might not be comfortable trying to find this information on the internet, it's almost always listed on your [credit/debit/atm/etc] card itself.

As mjevans says above, it's fine if they tell you there's a problem, but you should never try to solve that problem over the phone based on a call by a stranger.

Unless you know exactly what you're doing, what you should do in the case of any over-the-phone problem like that, is first contact someone you trust and knows what they're doing. Your own bank, an expert of your choosing (and not chosen by the stranger on the phone), or a knowledgeable friend or family member.

Never trust the stranger on the phone.

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