Comment by mikestew | Hacker News Reader

Comment by mikestew | Hacker News Reader

Back in high school when myself and fellow cross-country running buddies were full of piss and vinegar, we decided one morning to jump in a high school friend's pond (with permission of course). The trick was that the water was just cold enough to have really thin veneer of ice on top. Down to our shorts, and in we go. TFA says "your body goes into shock". I guess that's the best, albeit inadequate, way to describe it. It was like my heart stopped, and whatever makes my lungs work didn't work anymore. Gave it a second, and things kicked back in...sort of. I simply cannot imagine expending anymore effort than simple survival, let alone actually swim somewhere. I mean, how you gonna swim when you can't fucking move? After a minute, we got out and our friend had towels waiting.

Lessons learned: 1. That goes on my list of things "no matter how good it sounds, no matter how much peer pressure, do not EVER do that again."

2. You fall off the Titanic into the North Atlantic, you ain't gonna last long no matter what the movies tell you. Based on my one, brief experience, I wonder if I wouldn't just quickly give up and get it over with. At least death stands a chance of not being indescribably cold.

3. The guy in TFA is 100% USDA Certified Bad Ass in my book. I've been in water only slightly warmer. I literally cannot imagine attempting such a thing. It's like pulling half your spark plugs, watering down the gas, then saying, "now, go drive across town. If you break down, elephant seals will eat you."

Mario Vittone has some great factual information about the realities of drowning in cold water.

https://gcaptain.com/cold_water/

"It is impossible to die from hypothermia in cold water unless you are wearing flotation, because without flotation – you won’t live long enough to become hypothermic."

Great read.

Or it's in shallow water. I once fell through ice over a frozen creek and was close to hypothermia before I found another camp group after I'd been inadverntently left behind by my parents during a winter camping trip (each of my parents thought I was with the other). I was soaked in about 10F temps, but I was able to warm up, but not dry out, next to a fire. I was 9 or 10 at the time.

Holy hell, that must have been frightening. What was going through your head at the time?

His facts are a little off, but it is a good article. For example, he states, "When the water is cold (say under 50 degrees F) there are significant physiological reactions that occur, in order, almost always...You Can’t Breathe"

But he's painting with a too broad brush. In other words, some people experience those symptoms, others don't. For instance, my fellow swimmer Brenden Sullivan swam in Tahoe at 38º F (well below 50) and didn't experience the can't-breathe symptoms).

Few people in the open water swim club that experience the loss of breath: most people get in the water & start swimming without problems. I do experience the loss of breath when the water temperature drops below 52º F:. In fact, I have to do backstroke for the first 50 yards before my breath normalizes. But I'm the only one I know who suffers like that.

Also, body fat makes a big difference, but muscle, not as much. I've seen too many body builders shiver in the sauna after swimming in the Bay. Body fat makes a big difference; big-time open water swimmers are not svelte.

> I simply cannot imagine expending anymore effort than simple survival, let alone actually swim somewhere.

I've been in ice cold (including ice covered) water a few times, mostly voluntarily. So has a number of my friends, including some close friends/family who are more extreme and used to swim in the sea every week all through the Norwegian winter.

Focus on breathing seems to be the best advice I picked up (and also of course have friends nearby). Also testing it in a shower with the coldest cold water you can get might give you an idea of what to expect, as well help you get used to the breathing.

With the breathing during exposure to cold water I find focusing on slow and controlled exhalation is the most important thing. People tend to go the other way and do lots of shallow, gasping in-takes.

On an unseasonably warm March day on the Mississippi between Minnesota and Wisconsin I went tubing and water skiing with some friends. They went skiing and wake boarding, with a wetsuit on. I went tubing with nothing but my trunks and a life jacket. The water was ice cold. I knew they were going to try and toss me so I dragged my knees in the water. They were numb in a minute. Eventually they got me off. As soon as I slipped into the water I experienced exactly what you did. I couldn't breathe or move. If I didn't have a life jacket on I'd have gone under before they ever turned the boat around. Life jackets save lives. Especially in cold water.

Meh. My Mum used to break the ice on our local lake and have a paddle quite regularly. She was in her fifties then...

Wim Hof....

The reaction you describe is typical newb thing, your body will gradually adapt. I can swim in this kind of water without problems and don't get this shock when entering.

Thanks for relating your experience. I've wondered, but man, that just doesn't seem like something one's body would adapt to. But I am more than willing to just take your word for and not find out for myself. :-)

Still, if you were on the Titanic and not a regularly participating member of the Polar Bear Club...

as a kid I once jumped off a dock into a pond during winter on a dare. I know exactly what you mean by "whatever makes my lungs work didn't work anymore". I can't really out words to it, just instant complete overwhelming shutdown.

I’ve experienced the same symptoms once... but it was in water that was about 74 degrees F.

Had the same experience, except it was a pool in one of the Dakota's. I could not move, and it was completely unexpected. I recovered in a few seconds and I'm sure the pool ladder is the only reason I got out without needing rescue.

I was trying to get into kayaking but the local water was so cold that there’s a risk of drowning if you go over/in because it’s so cold that you involuntarily gasp.

I don’t think anyone explained to me the extent to which a dry suit dampens that response (only your head get the full force) so that little fact scared the crap out of me. I’m not gonna go kayaking solo if I can end up dead.

Now that I’m farther south (and have rooms longer than 17 feet) I may try again.

We have a lot of issues near here (Olympia Washington) because it's really popular to tube/float/swim in one of the rivers here as spring and summer approach - but the river is snow melt from Mt Rainier and stays very cold until very late in the year, resulting in many water rescues.

> I've been in water only slightly warmer.

I think your water would have been significantly warmer.

Pond water with a thin veneer of ice on top would still be quite a bit warmer than -3˚C ocean water. People very regularly swim in lake water that has thick ice on top of it (after they cut a hole through).

> Pond water with a thin veneer of ice on top would still be quite a bit warmer than -3˚C ocean water.

Specifically, it would be pretty much exactly 0˚C at the top and 3.98 °C at the bottom. How thick the ice is does not matter. Whether than counts as "significantly" or just "slightly" warmer is a matter of opinion.

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