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meddlepal

Pretty much this, the only reason anyone gave Go any attention was:

1. The pedigree of the creators 2. Google's developer marketing

And now we are stuck with it thanks to traction.

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Go is by far my favourite language to develop with. After having done Java, C#, C/C++ and python.

I still love functional languages more but for using something in the 'industry', I wouldn't want to use something else anymore.

To be honest, I write a lot of Go... it's my main work language and I use it for some of my hobby work too.

I love some aspects of it, for example, I love that you can generally look at a piece of Go code and grok it quickly. I love the lack of exceptions, but I strongly dislike the lack of good error handling facilities.

The standard library is really solid..., it has tons of very high quality implementations for low level OS and systems work and the API's are consistent.

The lack of Generics annoys me a fair bit. I do not love the module system at all. The Go folks somehow still managed to fuck up logging despite plenty of history in Python and Java about how not to do it, and how to build a good logging system. Also the lack of a good immutability construct really upsets me.

I feel people gave Golang attention because it was a good language. It also has the best standard library I’ve ever seen.

Like a standard library that doesn't even have a max function for integers, or a set type?

how easy to fuck up a max function?

Now look at the standard library and appreciate the fact that it comes with every crypto algorithm that are useful, heck it even comes with a crypto random function and a TLS implementation! Wait, it actually comes with a http(s) library. And with a json serializer/deserializer as well. Who does that?

Again that's the ethos of Go. In the many years I spent writing C++ or Python or Haskell I never had to write a max function because it's already there. I don't even need to think about it. And I can compose it easily to form more sophisticated things.

> Who does that?

Have you taken a look at the Python standard library?

I’ve never heard of anyone using crypto from the python standard library

It is trivial to write both of these on your own, why do we need unnecessary abstraction for such a simple task.

Sorting, appending to a slice, or removing from the middle of a slice are all awkward and bad in Go.

That's the ethos of Go. The standard library can be poor and woefully incomplete because hey it's easy to reinvent the wheel. And then instead of composing functions (say, a reduce function applied to max to find the max of a sequence), users just end up rewriting everything because it's trivial.

> Google's developer marketing

Like Google did marketing for Dart and it picked up?

Dart lost the support from Chrome team, it was rescued by AdWords team and Flutter is trying to make it relevant, but given Android team answers, it is clear that a power struggle is going on across teams.

Giliad is also a personality from language research hardly known by UNIX fans.

Seems like time killed the adoption of Dart into Chrome.

The chrome team had "been wanting to fix Webkit for a very long time, and the Blink fork made that possible"

Moving Blink from ref counting to a traced GC was part of that fix, it also was required to be completed to allow the Dart VM to be added to chrome. What was supposed to take months took years and with no end in sight the Dart team announced that its VM would not ship with chrome.

Lars announces the oilpan project Google I/O 2013. https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2850&v=huawCRlo9...

And now they moved on into https://www.toitware.com/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPna6D21Eqg

Thanks, have been looking for an update on toitware, had only found a 15 minute video in English by Kasper.

With Dart going down the flutter path, work on the dart iot project, dartino stop. Thanks again, just starting to watch the video now.

> it is clear that a power struggle is going on across teams.

What this has got to do with Dart's popularity outside Google?

> Giliad is also a personality from language research hardly known by UNIX fans.

So unix fans did not let a superior language which was designed by real language researcher like Dart win?

Exactly, had Dart been accepted into other browsers, and TypeScript wouldn't probably matter nowadays.

Just like WebAssembly wouldn't be a thing had PNaCL been accepted by others.

For UNIX fans, whatever a former Bell Labs researcher states is gold, no criticism whatsoever allowed.

curious how googles developer marketing got us a solid golang standard library

Or maybe because it is a useful and productive language?

I have feeling the people who praise Go didn't use too many other languages.

In my workplace Go is the preferred language, but I don't enjoy it, its type system stands in the way on every step.

It's almost as good as Blub, that's for sure...

Productive is an overstatement.

PS:I use Golang everyday.

Where exactly Google marketed the language, please gave us any example.

They talk about it at Google IO, for example.

But then to be fair, they also talk about Kotlin and other languages..

Which they also market, so?

The parent seemed to think they gave Go an unfair advantage by marketing it at Google IO. My point being that I don't think it's an unfair advantage as they mention non-google langs as well.

Google I/O has 0 materials about Go.

Today, because Go has its own conventions.

It used to have in 2012, 2013, 2014, etc...

https://blog.golang.org/go-videos-from-google-io-2012

Go only has the use that it does because of Google marketing, which the only examples given are talks at Google IO? Google has the most efficient marketing team in the world, to have done that much with that little effort...

I have no dog in this fight. The guy asked for any example, which I provided because I've personally seen go talks at IO.

> Google's developer marketing

Pretty sure Go was a huge 'failure' for a long time (in terms of marketshare)

The bar for a new language has become sky high. It takes years and years to even start to become a contender.

I observe this without celebration. It simply is.

Even Google's other languages, some of which have been around just as long, aren't even doing as well as Go.

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