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Comment by seanwilson | Hacker News Reader

> I've been a vegetarian for about 4 years and the cognitive dissonance you start to see is remarkable. People claim to love animals and hate animal cruelty through mouthfuls of burger and pork.

Can you explain why producing eggs and cow milk is any less cruel than producing animals only for meat?

In terms of cognitive dissonance, I have a hard time understanding the rational behind vegetarianism to be honest when a vegetarian presumably has looked into the animal farming industry more than a meat eater.

Dairy cows and egg laying hens are still killed very early into their natural life span once their yields drop with the cows being killed for meat, males from dairy cows are killed within weeks as veal because males can't be milked, and any male chickens born are gassed or ground up within days of their life because they don't lay eggs.

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> Can you explain why producing eggs and cow milk is any less cruel than producing animals only for meat?

You're running wild with an assumption that isn't true. Of course it's just as cruel. I don't purchase dairy or eggs, and only consume eggs in restaurants on rare occasions. Really you're preaching to the choir here.

Why do you mention vegetarianism and not e.g. plant-based or vegan then when referring to people being blind to animal cruelty? I genuinely find vegetarianism confusing and want to understand the rationale behind it, especially when someone knows the dairy and egg industry is similarly cruel.

I can't speak for vegetarianism as a whole. The word is ambiguous at best and only useful as a pointer to the layperson. Most people don't even understand the differences between vegan and vegetarian. Ultimately I find veganism is a form of extremism that isn't right for everyone. Any level of mindful eating is admirable, even if someone changes their constant diet of meat to one of having 1 day a week meat-free for the sake of animals and the environment is worth applauding.

> Any level of mindful eating is admirable, even if someone changes their constant diet of meat to one of having 1 day a week meat-free for the sake of animals and the environment is worth applauding.

These kind of baby steps never lead anywhere fruitful. The end goal must be worked towards. Applauding any and every tiny effort just makes people complacent and we never make any real progress. E.g. most vegetarians have no plans to transition to veganism, despite knowing about the cruelties of the egg and dairy industries (which are the same as the poultry and beef industries, just a different point in the pipeline).

Personally, I wish people in general were more educated about the cruelty behind milk, eggs and cheese, so they would seek alternatives.

Vegetarians appear to suffer from cognitive dissonance as well.

We're talking about two different things for two different purposes.

It is possible for people to eat meat and not experience any cognitive dissonance because they're mindfully aware of what they're consuming, what has gone into it, and the reason behind it. See Native Americans as an example. Yes, even the Dalai Lama consumes meat. I don't judge people for their dietary choices. I'm specifically talking about people who gorge on a diet carelessly at the expense of the environment and the economy as a point of evidence that we're unlikely to ever see antibiotics being diminished in the market in our lifetimes.

No offense intended but this is getting derailed a little bit because you seem to be using this thread as a soapbox to push an agenda unrelated to the discussion.

> because you seem to be using this thread as a soapbox to push an agenda unrelated to the discussion.

It reads more like you continuing to find excuses to not be accountable. Is the Dalia Lama some ethical authority to hold up as a standard for others? He's just a religious figure important to a specific group of Buddhists.

Thanks for calling this out. It's baffling to come across vegetarians at all (I'm vegan btw) talking about ethics. To me it's worse than an omni who thinks they care about animals, because a vegetarian has taken some steps to look into the details, but then decides to stop short.

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