Hacker News Reader

Comment by rland | Hacker News Reader

You’re right, of course. I grew up nearby and spent many summers there as a kid, that’s why I have some connection. But the place is not mine.

The reason I brought it up in the first place is because only within the last 10 years has it really gotten “bad” — completely because of instagram.

View on HN

you're on to something, but are missing an important part of the equation

instagram influencing is now a business. it's advertising without the clear disclaimers or statements for who is paying for that advertising and why

a lot of this advertising requires traveling to cool/famous/chic/rugged locations and taking photos or videos there, so that followers feel they are also there, and get to see a cool place through the eyes of their "friends"

it's more than just social points gamification, it's a business, it's advertising with real money involved, and these natural settings are becoming the new ad studios that it's cool to shoot in (besides places like venice beach and rue cremieux)

and when businesses/money get involved, the natural respect for the environment/others using the space disintegrates in the face of profit and time maximization

Blaming a website (I don't use Instagram and I am not a fan of it) for people's generally shitty behavior is stretching it, don't you think? It is absolutely possible to travel respectfully (one can't avoid the plane ride, other than that, sure) - respecting the local people, landmarks, wildlife etc. But many travelers lack this basic decency and common sense - even if Instagram died today, these people would continue to behave the same.

Instagram is in some sense just a label for the greater phenomenon.

I don't think you can blame instagram. These problems are happening all over the world, and I doubt that many of the tourists actually use instagram.

I suspect cheap flights and accommodation, changes in fashion (city breaks vs package holidays), more disposable income and free time are all contributing.

Yes, this has been happening the last 100 years or so, to different locations over the world. There is always something that gets noticed on TV or whatever channel exists att he time. And then some entrepreneur uses the hype to make trips with tourists to this location.

Just an example: https://www.slice.ca/travel/photos/most-popular-travel-spots...

Yes, this has been happening the last 100 years or so

A lot longer than that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Tour

A lot longer than that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilgrimage

And a lot longer than that: http://ieg-ego.eu/en/threads/europe-on-the-road/the-history-...

I think any solution needs to be better than “ it was okay when only rich people could do it, but became a problem when poorer people could do it too”

You're making it a class problem when nobody here has mentioned class.

Cheap flights and accommodations were mentioned.

Flying is an unusual product that gets cheaper over time. Supply has increased.

Airbnb has had an impact on hotel pricing and availability.

Almost every product gets cheaper over time.

Inflation says otherwise.

Inflation does not change the real cost of goods and services, only the nominal cost.

And the costs of flying and accommodation have actually gone down in real terms.

That's not true outside of theoretical context, much like the concept of efficient markets. In reality, inflation does change the relative real costs due to the mechanism by which inflationary monetary policy is implemented: debt. Products that rely heavily on debt (construction, airlines, etc.) will be affected by inflation differently from products that use little of it (technology, fashion, food service, etc.)

That's an interesting, but unusual perspective.

It's commonly understood that not all prices change in lock step, but "inflation" is the general or aggregate change in prices, usually based on the change in the purchasing power of money. Choosing to finance or pay cash for a car or a house doesn't change the price of the item, just your cost of acquiring it - it exposes you to expected future inflation, in addition to the current price, because you will be paying back the incurred debt with less-valuable future dollars. The interest you pay also pays for the use of someone else's money for the period of the debt.

Note, too, that inflationary monetary policy is also implemented by creating money in other ways, like a printing press, and inflation can also be caused by supply/demand shocks, like changes in supply/demand of fundamental commodities, like oil.

I just don't think this is true. I mean, I see your point, but it just doesn't seem to be that significant in practice. Possibly because the interest you get at a bank has inflation priced in. In reality, more or less everything is getting cheaper in real terms. There are some exceptions, like housing (urban land), and services (people's time) but these are exceptions.

They were describing an alternate explanation of the cause of the problem, not a solution. And yes, an activity can go from being not a problem to a problem when poor people start do it because there are a lot more poor people than rich people. 1000 people doing something will cause a lot more wear and tear than 10 people. Also, with greater numbers, there's a greater chance of one of them being a thoughtless jerk who causes harm.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com