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Comment by merinowool | Hacker News Reader

Men are not wired for monogamy. It is like saying you might be bad person because you breathe. In a relationship this is a mutual effort to resist those needs, but failing to do so doesn't make you bad.

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I find it hard to imagine most social norms, and much of what we consider to be good/bad behavior, is reliant on what we're "wired" towards; influenced by, sure, but I would imagine most of it is along the lines of "regardless of human nature, this is the way we should operate". Respecting monogamy, at least in America, is one of those things: regardless of how we naturally would like to behave, we are expected to (and promise to) respect the sanctity of marriage. That one fails to is not excused by our wiring; we obviously should be capable of exceeding that. It is, supposedly, one of those abilities that make humans as a species notable.

And if we go to an extreme, that you operate solely on your wiring and nothing else... well, you're hardly a modern human at that point.

And dare I say it... not only "one of those abilities that make humans as a species notable", but

...one of those abilities that make humans as a species noble.

> Respecting monogamy, at least in America, is one of those things: regardless of how we naturally would like to behave, we are expected to (and promise to) respect the sanctity of marriage.

When did residing in a particular nation-state define such specific moral boundaries? Are you saying if I move to China I can cheat on my spouse because that's how things are done there? It seems you are applying your own morals to 300 million members of a very diverse group of people.

Im saying that I'm only going to speak for country I know. I considered christian/puritan, but its not just them, and I thought perhaps abrahamic was sufficient, but im not sure of the muslim treatment. I'm also aware that hindus curremtly have a far stricter, and more culturally/socially enforced, view on marriage; most Americans I've met have difficulty even processing how important they take marriage to be, arranged or by love. The non-christian chinese and africans, I have no idea.

So I'll only make the general claims for Americans.

We’re also wired for murdering, raping and pillaging. That’s not gonna stop me from judging people who succumb to their desires at the expense of other people

What expense does a person suffer if they are being cheated on? Some forms of cheating involve financial irresponsibility, but not all. Some forms involve health risks, but not all. So let's not generalize all cheaters as perpetrators of harm to their first partners.

Judge all you want, but if it ain't illegal don't shove your values down people's throat.

Do you realise you're using the word "cheater"?

Having multiple relationships, known to all parties is subjectively wrong and we can argue about it as much as we want.

Agreeing to a monogamistic relationship and secretly breaking that agreement, as implied by your use of the word "cheater", is objectively wrong.

Actually, cheating involves lying. A spouse is explicitly or at least implicitly expecting the other part no to lie about extra relations. If lying about those extra relations in this context doesn't makes you a bad person, then I don't know what is.

Fair point. If I knew a couple in an open relationship, I'd be uncomfortable, but I wouldn't make a judgment on their integrity.

Logical fallacy. Doing one bad thing does not make one a "bad person" if such a thing even exists.

If the alternative is to break up a family so the cheater can be 'honest' with him-/herself, is a lie and a happy family worse than a broken family? Stop seeing things black and white.

At the beginning a family is made of two parents. When only one parent takes such dramatic decisions as to lie to their spouse in order to hide its cheating under the umbrella "its for the best of the family", then I stand to my point of view: this person is acting badly (shortcuted to "a bad person").

And I can understand specific contextes, so don't come up with things like "what if the other is handicapped".

But it's ok, you place value in peace of mind, I place value in respect, different points of view, nothing new, no big deal.

I don't believe in happy relationships based on lies. The deception will always affect the relationship.

- If someone wants to believe the lies, then in order to avoid discovering the truth, they will keep the relationship intentionally superficial.

- If someone doesn't want to believe the lies, they will discover the truth sooner or later and they will just be acting through life.

Ask the wife whether she'd prefer to know, then decide whether the alternative is preferable. And besides that, other alternatives exist too. Marriage counseling is a thing.

Yes, hypocrisy is one of the worst things that you can to yourself and others.

Think about it this way. The guy who, with his nature and peer pressure both strongly incentivizing him to cheat on his wife, and still not cheating on her, that person is much more likely to be trustworthy. At least predictable and dependable.

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