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Comment by mkalygin | Hacker News Reader

I'm Russian. And while I agree that we have a propaganda, I can't say that the situation is any better in the West.

When I was living in UK for a while, I was amazed by how some really smart people have 100% level of trust to national media, so that they can't even perceive another point of view. All arguments were based on the fact that their media is historically old and never lies because it can't risk its reputation. And all Russian media is propaganda and controlled by Putin. It was 2014 and I can't say how much I was asked what I think about Putin. Honestly I didn't know what to answer because I don't like to talk about politics.

But since that time I know that if you look around the world you will notice the same BS but in different boxing. And people are equally vulnerable to buy it.

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I agree with you that there are many people in the West who have (almost) 100% trust in national media, and that that level of trust is misplaced, but I don't agree at all that the situation is the same as in Russia (where I've been and where I know some people).

The difference is that here in the West there are lots of agendas being pushed, but there are also lots of competing ones, lots of different points of view, and much more freedom to express them. The end result is - or at least was, the situation isn't improving lately - that the government can't get away with lies as big as the ones Putin pushes (eg: "we have no soldiers in Ukraine" "we're never going to annex Crimea" etc. etc.)

I cannot disagree with your point. But we still have a lot of people who refuse to get information from propaganda sources. And this is a good sign. I hope we will get even better in this in the future and there will be more freedom in media.

Absolutely, I didn't mean that all Russians buy the propaganda - I also know how distrustful of the government you are on average. But it's a fact that it's very difficult to get good news sources for those who only understand Russian.

Yes we have lots of agendas, but in my lifetime only one agenda has been constant through all the surface changes: spend more money fighting more wars. At least when the Russians fight a war, they win, sometimes. The lie about USA military/LEO effectiveness is so big you can't even see it as a proposition that could be true or false. It's like water to a fish.

When it comes to big issues (eg the UKs EU referendum or national elections in either the US or UK) I don't believe there are a lot of agendas being pushed. If anything, the majority of the mainstream press tend to rally behind the same interests and that position is usually the one that the owners of said news outlet stand to gain the most. (eg leaving the EU, supporting a corporation friendly government such as Trump / Tories, even denying climate change so they have fewer restrictions et al running their business).

Just because there is more choice in "independent" news outlets, it doesn't mean there is more independent opinions being voiced.

Well, if the NYT or The Guardian aren't mainstream, then what is? And they were both against the outcome of those two situations..

Obviously there are going to be exceptions to the rule, hence why the language I used didn't say "all" or other exclusive terms. However the ratio would seem to be in the favour of right wing politics Vs left wing - and particularly so if you also factor in copies sold of each specific publication into your analysis.

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