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Comment by rybosome | Hacker News Reader

So how deep into the consequences are we going to get before the debate over its reality ends?

Apparently climate change is hard to reason about due to our cognitive biases. I know that Kaheman has lost a little luster of late I still buy this:

"Kahneman won the 2002 Nobel prize in economics for his research on the psychological biases that distort rational decision- making. One of these is “loss aversion”, which means that people are far more sensitive to losses than gains. He regards climate change as a perfect trigger: a distant problem that requires sacrifices now to avoid uncertain losses far in the future. This combination is exceptionally hard for us to accept, he told me."[0]

That said, I think that the thing that will make people change their behavior is not so much how bad it gets but the economics. If it's cheaper to use renewables than burning fuels then people will switch. Thinking about one's short-term economic choices ($1 < $2) is mostly simpler than thinking about global issues that are at odds with one's cognitive biases, and one's choices to ignore scientists.

[0] https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22329820-200-understa...

I fear that an entire generation of older Americans simply will not accept climate change is real. The question is how much political power they will have in the coming years. We might still be having these debates in a decade. Sadly.

I fear that an entire generation of older

Ageist nonsense. The older generation grew up in a time when they repaired things. The younger generation buy a new phone or laptop every year and chuck the old one in landfill. The old generation made and repaired clothes, young people buy clothes made in sweatshops halfway around the world and wear them for one season then throw them in landfill. Older people ate food grown locally, young people love imported foods like soy and quinoa. Who are the REAL deniers? Look at actions not mere words.

Surveys have shown fairly consistently over the years that (at least in the US) the denial of climate change is larger in the older cohorts.

I'm not sure why those older generations would be so keen to repair their clothes but not their planet, my own theory would be decades of propaganda from the likes of Fox has divorced them from reality and therefore their own self-interest but maybe they just want to torch the world on their way out.

Surveys have shown fairly consistently

Oh yes, younger people will always SAY the right things, social media has taught them that, but then jet off on holiday, or buy the latest phone when their old one was perfectly good... Look at tangible actions, not virtue signalling and you will see the truth of what I say.

>Who are the REAL deniers? Look at actions not mere words.

You're making a good point in a really poor way. Just because the older generation acts more responsibly when it comes to consumption does not change the fact that they are also denying climate change. Those are clearly unrelated.

You're right that actions matter more than words, but that doesn't make your point true.

This is how humans work, and the same is said about science. Both advance one grave at a time.

Its not just a generational issue, its also a religious one. A massive barrier to acceptance is admitting that humans have the ability to render earth uninhabitable, something that God either A) wouldn't allow to happen, or worse B) is allowing to happen because its part of the end times.

Why try to fix the problem if we aren't the masters of our own destiny?

What should really be happening, at least from a Christian perspective, is that we should be good stewards of the earth.

"God wouldn't allow that to happen" is not a very Christian thing to say.

Job 1:21 - "Naked I came from my mother’s womb, And naked shall I return there. The Lord gave, and the Lord has taken away; Blessed be the name of the Lord."

I hate how real I think this probably is. Anecdotally there is massive crossover between religious individuals and climate change deniers among people I know.

And only 33% of people in the world are Christian. Other religions might have an even larger fraction of climate change deniers.

I doubt it correlates as well. American Christian 'leaders' (specifically Evangelicals) have strategically married their religion and conservative talking points. It (climate change belief) is not as associated with identity in other cultures.

Until it can be told that it's too late to do anything anyway.

that argument started in early 2000 and continues to grow. it is a dumb argument but you can be sure that is where the rhetoric is heading.

Ah, the point of no return, i.e. the genesis of global warming alarmism.

One of the biggest PR blunders for climate change.

For all those who are pro-climate change, please stop saying "we've reached the point of no return." It doesn't help people change, which is what your goal should be.

Shaming people is all good fun, but it doesn't help your end goal.

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