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Comment by satysin | Hacker News Reader

Also see this comment https://medium.com/@sarawinge/i-remember-that-night-17f5bf2a...

And this tweet from Tim O'Reilly https://twitter.com/timoreilly/status/921124414418182144

Created a Code of Conduct? What the heck is wrong with these people? Full stop, you call the police immediately. You do not cover it up. Was he raised by a PR firm?

Reading this just made realize how bonkers it is that we aren't actually calling the police.

If some guy was smashing people's laptops, this would be an obvious option on the spectrum of ways to handle it. But here....

Granted, this also means attention to the victim, and given how society treats people making these claims it can be an extremely scary step forward to make for them, on top of the experience itself.

The victim got enough attention without involving the police to commit suicide. Silence netted nothing and I would lay even odds that this wasn’t the last incident.

That was a different victim and the way the story was related it seems that her identity was leaked to that particular community. Scoble's victim at the campfire has remained anonymous.

>Full stop, you call the police immediately.

In an ideal world where calling the police does not invite greater danger, yes.

What is your solution? This course of action got the victim killed. If you don’t call the cops it will happen again. Sexual predators don’t stop at one. Life is devastated when you are the victim of a crime, but you need to save the next person too.

This is a monstrous position. It should not be on the victim to be held responsible for the perpetrator's subsequent victims.

A victim's main responsibility is to their self; trying to survive, heal and move forward in whatever way they can, not to relive their trauma. To prioritize future prevention above their self preservation by placing the burden of justice on an already suffering person's shoulders (as if there could possibly be better, nuanced ways to seek solutions) is just asinine.

Due to severe consequences to victims (such as the harassment and suicide mentioned in TFA), calling the police may be against the victim's wishes and harmful to them.

That’s the problem. Not calling the cops doesn’t solve the problem. It turns it into a civil matter rather than the criminal act it is. By not calling the authorities and pressing charges, they just gave tacit approval to the behavior. It wasn’t like this assault was some he-said, she-said — it was indisputable with witnesses.

Call the cops. Get these guys sent to prison. That does a lot more than blogging vigorously about one’s displeasure.

The victim should not be blamed for giving 'tacit approval' for an assailant's behaviour. There is no necessary connection between a victim wishing to avoid the ordeal of a rape/assault prosecution and believing that rape/assault is 'okay'. Rape prosecutions in the US tend to be long, extremely adversarial, and unlikely to result in a conviction. Unfortunately, rape/assault are crimes that still carry bi-directional social stigma on those involved.

There was already a national debate about this at US colleges. See: Title IX as it pertains to sexual assault on campus.

Victims largely don't want their school to call the cops when all they want is their attacker to be kept away from them.

Again, there can be severe and lethal consequences for the victim when their identity is made public.

If Scoble had been arrested, charged, and gone to trial, it would send a clear message. Hiding doesn’t help the next person and allows for more victims. The suicide might have happened anyway, but the not raising a fuss sure didn’t prevent self harm.

> The suicide might have happened anyway, but

There has to be a better way for you to argue your position than hand-waving away the gravity of a suicide. If there isn’t, maybe that should tell you something.

I don’t hand wave the suicide. It is a horrible thing and all too common in some forgotten areas of the country. The lifetime scarring of a significant number of people is brutal. I dearly wish more attention were paid particularly when someone thinks it’s ok to send a bunch of partially trained individuals to stop a suicide cluster in a high school. I take suicide and the threat of suicide seriously.

If the result is the worst possible one way (suicide and perpetrator walking free) then the other way at least might have resulted in a better outcome. Reading anything beyond that into what I wrote is just plain wrong.

You seem to be under the impression that there are only two “ways” to deal with situations having to do with sexual assault. I’m suggesting that perhaps it’s a bit more sophisticated of a discussion than that.

For anyone who isn't totally triggered and incapable of thinking by these debates please read Camille Paglia. Bottom line - if you are raising a daughter, do you want her to believe some white knight is going to come to her rescue every time she walks into a dark alley? This mentality is the first thing that breaks down self when dealing with a Harvey Weinstein. Camille Paglia explains this in a much more constructive way that I ever could.

There are multiple ways, but either the perpetrator had the cops called on them or they didn’t. That’s a binary choice.

I don’t see how the above comment relates to your comment I responded to. You seem to be moving on from the ‘hand wave’ comment.

To be fair, a Code of Conduct is meant to cover a lot of things that the police won't be able to do much with. Rape is one (horrible) thing, but sexual harassment that doesn't lead to rape is still very bad and unacceptable, but usually not something you can call the police to deal with.

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