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Comment by Kluny | Hacker News Reader

> I went through a ton of iterations and debugging to get this to work. The hardest parts were the electrical design and getting everything to fit inside the phone.

Crikey! How many iphones did he drill holes in?

> I also ended up having to buy lots, and lots, and lots of spare parts. I went through 3 complete iPhone 7s, a handful of screens, and countless internal components (mostly bottom cable assemblies and taptic engines).

3. Ok, that's dedication.

> I feel like I got extremely lucky about finding space inside the phone. There was inexplicably a lot of extra room in the lower left hand corner, right where I wanted to put the headphone jack.

Suspicious... almost like their engineers left room to change their minds about the jack at the last second if they wanted to :)

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Someone pointed out on Reddit last night - that it seemed obvious to him that Apple likely removed the headphone in the iPhone 7 to get the controversy out of the way ahead of the iPhone 8, which wouldn't have any room in it for a headphone jack - and for which said controversy would be a distraction against launching a new flagship device.

It also could be that quite a few of their designers managed to stay below their volume budgets, and they didn't want to risk a redesign, given their (presumably) strict deadlines.

Alternatively, the space was set apart as a hedge against the AirPods not being ready at he time of the launch of the iPhone 7 (yes, they were late, but not _that_ late. Presumably (again) they knew they could make them when they made the decision to remove the headphone from the iPhone 7)

There are plenty of Bluetooth headphones beyond AirPods. I'm sure they aren't even the most popular ones used with iPhones.

Yes, there are, and no, they may not be (1)

However, chances are they are the Bluetooth headphones Apple makes the most money on, and that early adopters of the new iPhone are the most likely to buy them.

Inducing (extra) demand for Bluetooth headphones and then leaving the market for such headphones to others in a period where your most 'able and willing to spend' customers enter your shop isn't the best of ideas.

(1) (nitpicking) it wouldn't completely surprise me if they were, though, because Apple has exactly one product, whereas its competition tends to create zillions of 'different' products.

I've seen plenty of iPhone 7s, and very few air pods. They don't even seem like a good idea.

I personally got conductive wireless headphones and really like them. Not Apple, of course.

I find AirPods to be one of the most amazing devices I've owned. Using them is a pure joy. No joke. From the feeling of the case opening and closing, to the sound of them dropping into the case, to the instant pairing when you put them in your ear.

Nice to know. I've still not seen many in the wild, while I've seen plenty of misc brand wireless headphones.

Conductive is the future I think, I'm never sticking anything in my ear again.

the hedging might have something to do with the W1 chip[0] improvements in the AirPods that provided for fast and consistent bluetooth pairing that Apple cared about more so than relying upon 3rd party bluetooth experience in a headphone connector-less flagship phone.

[0] https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/12/apple-w1-chip-how-it-works/

What makes you so sure?

I don't understand this. Why would the controversy be any less when releasing the iPhone 7 without a headphone jack vs the iPhone 8? Aren't they both new flagship models?

The author of the original Reddit comment[0] meant that Apple wanted to bear the brunt of the controversy early on so that the missing headphone jack would already be "normal" and not the center of attention when the iPhone 8 releases.

[0] https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/6yhbuu/guy_adds_func...

The iPhone 7 is a small iteration over the iPhone 6S where as the iPhone 8 is a new design. I think they expect the iPhone 8 to be a much more important/larger release and that is probably true.

The new iPhone is set to be released this year which makes it the 10th anniversary of the original iPhone. It's also (supposedly) a much larger redesign than previous models. I think it makes sense for them to rip the band-aid off early. Especially considering that most reviews for the AirPods have been overwhelmingly positive, it's good to get the negative press out of the way early. Smart move on their part, I think.

Because the iPhone 7 was released a year ago, and people are generally over it now. I say people, not enthusiasts. Now, the feature can be released in the iPhone 8 and it's not a big deal.

But that doesn't explain why it would be preferable to remove the headphone jack in 2016 and have people be used to it by 2017, rather than the same but a year later.

Whether there is technically room for a headphone jack means nothing to a consumer who would like to have one on their iPhone. As far as I can see there is no difference from the consumer's point of view which year the change happens in.

There is. The iPhone 7 is the no headphone jack phone.

The iPhone 8 will be the 100% screen phone. It also won't have a headphone jack.

Big difference for how people think about that and how it gets talked about.

It's because the key takeaway with a newly 3.5mm jack-less iPhone 8 will be 1. no headphone jack and 2. 100% screen.

Because they did this before on the iPhone 7, Apple execs are hoping that the key consumer takeaway for iPhone 8 will be 100% screen

> But that doesn't explain why it would be preferable to remove the headphone jack in 2016 and have people be used to it by 2017, rather than the same but a year later.

Perception. People focus on something more when it changes, and there's only so much focus to go around. Remove the headphone jack a year earlier, and it's not a "change" that it's still missing from the next model. So focus/attention can be more concentrated on new features that Apple brings to the newer "10th anniversary" iPhone.

"Yeah, but it still doesn't have a headphone jack" is a rational reaction, but not the one that most people will have. It's irrelevant background noise, compared to the shouts of "Look at all the new shiny!", which is the reaction that Apple's going for.

Maybe they envisioned iPhone 8 to be a bigger game changer than the iPhone7 was.

w.r.t. empty space: I once met an RF engineer that specialized in cell antennas. He said the first 1/4 of the project was doing complex RF simulations of many design iterations. The last 3/4 of the project schedule was spent defending the empty space around the antenna that enabled it to work. Said in jest, but I suspect it contained a lot of truth.

You should check his video on this, the guy also casually bought a dremmel, a printer and a fucking microscope (stereoscope?) in the process of making this....

But these are Shenzhen prices, not western retail prices.

I'm pretty sure that "Dremel" didn't cost him much over $10.

Scotty, the guy in the video here. Sorry I'm late to the party. It was 165 rmb, so about $25.

Same price as one at Harbor Freight in the US. https://www.harborfreight.com/80-piece-rotary-tool-kit-97626...

On reddit he mentions shooting 225 hours of footage:

https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/6ygqxk/guy_who_made...

And? Do you not spend money on hobbies / side projects?

What does your question have to do with the fact the Op just said?

Electronics projects require equipment like that. Those are available in makerspaces near most people in America anyway.

What is weird/interesting about buying a dremel or printer? They are pretty normal, casual purchases

> empty space exactly where the jack was

What was the party line for removing it again?

Courage.

Water proofing.

There are phones that claim to be waterproof and still have headphone jacks.

Yes but that doesn't change the main reasoning behind Apples decision as it was publicly conveyed; water ingress.

> ingress

/pedant

Corrected, i was initially going to write that they've added some valve for egress to balance the pressure so that stuck :P

And I'm not sure it's being pedantic.

Some Thinkpads have put drain holes on the bottom connected to the keyboard, so water egress holes aren't that crazy an idea!

The iPhone shall remain hydrated for your satisfaction.

Quite likely that the decision has been made after the initial internal layout was set. The layout of the iPhone 7 isn't that different from the 6s.

> How many iphones did he drill holes in?

You can buy the cases without phone internals easily in the markets in Shenzhen. I don't think the guy drilled in a "live" iPhone 7, from what I can tell in the video, but he did go through a lot of parts trying to get his headphone jack and later the headphone-lightning connector to fit into the phone.

Correct. He also broke a bunch of screens in the final stages X-)

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