Hacker News Reader

Comment by notadoc | Hacker News Reader

Even the smartest and most technically capable people I know are confused by 3D Touch, almost all of whom eventually turned it off. What is it for? Why is it better than an alternative or a long press? How does it make anything better or more intuitive? How is it predictable in any way?

iOS has been consistently confusing and less intuitive ever since iOS 7, and iOS 10 and iOS 11 are only more so particularly the lock screens which are outright bizarre. They feel very much like they were built for designers, not for end users.

Come to think of it, a lot of what Apple does today feels like it was built for their own designers and not for users. Removing critical ports, 3D Touch, endless dongles, confusing UI and UX, the Touch Bar, awful low travel keyboards, etc etc

Apple used to pride itself in everything being obvious and everything just working as you would expect it to. Perhaps the biggest change in Apple post-Jobs is how that is missing.

View on HN

3D touch on the keyboard to move the cursor around makes up for every grievance I ever had about it to begin with.

I like that too, but how many users know about that? 0.5%? Is it obvious and intuitive?

How many computer users can operate a command line interface? It's not obvious or intuitive but obviously very powerful.

You really think the command line is of comparable complexity to simple text selection?

No, but but these are non-discoverable features, generally only used by enthusiastic users who have a deeper knowledge of the system they are using.

I would say that wanting to select text efficiently and effectively is not limited to enthusiasts. I get what you're saying, I just don't think it applies to a lot of the enigmatic UI/UX of post-Jobs (post-Forstall?) iOS.

Might not be entirely obvious and intuitive, but it's not required as well. I mean, iOS did without it for 10 years.

People complain about iOS not being for 'power users', but when they add features in like a secondary click or more fine-grained control, people complain about it not being obvious. How obvious is right clicking on a computer to bring up special features?

> How obvious is right clicking on a computer to bring up special features?

Well considering that most mice have 2 or 3 obvious physical buttons I would say the right-click on a mouse is pretty obvious. It has also be deeply ingrained in every Windows user since Windows 3.11 (maybe earlier?)

I would try spending time with an "average user". They do not use right click, nor keyboard shortcuts (which have also been around for ages). The average user is a basic user.

I don't know anyone who hasn't discovered that one

I'd much rather have arrow keys to move the cursor around. They're always in the same spot and you only need one finger to use them.

Unfortunately, if you replace the keyboard on iOS you lose the quick dictation key because Apple doesn't let the third party keyboard initiate dictation.

Speaking of dictation, Windows is finally going to bring a dictation key to their virtual keyboard this fall so I'll probably switch from iPad to Windows for my tablet needs. I really hate all of the web browsers on iOS and Android.

Apple put left and right arrow keys in the landscape mode of their default keyboard for iPhone+ models ― which you probably haven't heard off because it truly is as awful as that sounds. Yet another bullet point that Apple's UX design quality has taken a dive the past few years

That's correlation not causation; the iPads don't have 3D touch but still have cursor control in the default keyboard.

Indeed Apple tying 3D touch to cursor control on the iPhones makes me resent it more because they then removed the feature from the iPhones without 3D Touch.

>That's correlation not causation;

Or, more accurately, "that's orthogonal".

But the reason the iPads have it without 3D touch is because they have much larger screen estate (and also because they lack 3D touch).

On my jailbroken SE, I can just drag my finger around the keyboard for that. No 3D touch needed.

The new lock screen makes a lot of sense on the newer iPhones. They have raise to wake, and the newer touch ID sensors are so fast that you can't press the home button without unlocking it immediately.

If you want to see your notifications, just pick up the phone and swipe down from the top (since the screen will turn on automatically).

> The new lock screen makes a lot of sense on the newer iPhones.

Sure, but have you used it on an older phone?

Just recently I was trying to explain how to unlock an iPhone 6 hand-me-down to a relative by pressing on the Home button now that slide to unlock is gone. They initiated Siri 90% of the time instead of unlocking the phone. Is that good UX?

I know the “user is never wrong”, but sometimes it is up to the user to learn how to use an interface. I’m not saying I don’t have relatives with the same issue, but I would hope that we don’t design interfaces to cater to those who don’t care to learn the difference between “hold” and “press”. These verbs aren’t even technology-specific.

I would argue that good design should never be confusing and prevent errors and guess work to begin with.

A Poka Yoke UI. Interesting.

iPhone SE doesn't count as a 'newer iPhone' anymore?

I disagree.

The new lock screen/notification center combo is an abomination. I have an iPhone 6S Plus and am considering downgrading to iOS10 or jailbreaking solely because of the notification center fubar.

For the longest time, and made better in iOS10 - our primary mode of unfolding UI was directional. You swipe up and you get the control center. Swipe down to see your notifications.

Now we have this half brained implementation where direction is now secondary to virtual anchors. Swipe up to see your lock screen and last few notifications. Then swipe up to see older notifications. But don't swipe up from too far down or else you get your control center.

This is ironic given how terrible the iOS10 control center was with it's multi-direction paginating views. They appeared to learn their lesson and fixed the usability issue in their latest major revision. But here we are again, and it's terrible.

>at is it for? Why is it better than an alternative or a long press? How does it make anything better or more intuitive? How is it predictable in any way?

3D touch is totally different, and better than a long press. With a long press, you're stuck waiting on an animation to finish to continue with what you want to do. With 3D touch, you are able to instantly get to the menu you want.

I can admit that discover-ability is an issue, but this should be solvable by UX designers embracing the feature and highlighting when it would be useful to users.

> Even the smartest and most technically capable people I know are confused by 3D Touch

I think you may need to find yourself a new crowd to roll with. 3D Touch becomes pretty intuitive after just a few hours of playing with a 3D Touch enabled device. It especially shines on the Apple Watch but it's also fantastic on the iPhone. Sadly, it's missing from iPad.

If I have to play with it for a few hours before it makes sense, then it's too complicated and confusing.

I have better things to do than train myself to use a phone.

It takes 1 second to make sense. It takes a few hours before you form a new habit and it's second nature.

I hate things that have a different function for long press vs. 3D touch. It wasn't until 3D touch came out that I noticed I had always been applying pressure during a long press, and that led to a lot of confusion. Still does.

>Even the smartest and most technically capable people I know are confused by 3D Touch, almost all of whom eventually turned it off. What is it for?

Perhaps for me, who am not confused.

You must know some very odd people.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com