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Comment by askafriend | Hacker News Reader

> yet Tim did turn the tech juggernaut he was bequeathed into a watch band and sticker company.

That's such an incredibly simplistic view of Apple's strategy. I expected more out of the HN crowd.

I honestly think the moderation team should crack down more on these types of casual and innocuous statements that provide no value that they might as well be memes.

It's so incredibly easy to trivialize anything, especially when you don't understand it - and you see this happening more as a forum or subreddit grows bigger and the audience gets broader and less informed.

It's frustrating to say the least because instead of an actually interesting conversation, we're left with this drivel which isn't even fun to respond to or even entertain as a thought.

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> I expected more out of the HN crowd.

Don't underestimate the variance in small samples (especially when the sample size is 1).

The best thing you can do it is to not respond, or create a well argued thread about it, at least then it's on neutral ground.

It's ironic, and hilarious frankly, that your reply about vapidity was much more vapid than what you were complaining about.

Why don't you offer something of substance rather than complaining about substance.You are part of the 'HN crowd' you speak of and what you contribute literally forms part of this living, breathing community.

I specifically wanted to call out this particular statement because it can be so innocuous and it served as a great example of the problem I've been seeing more and more in comments.

I specifically wanted to float the idea about moderation intervention as a possible solution to the problem I pointed out. It's perhaps not the best solution, but it's a starting point.

How many more "Facebook is stupid and evil, Apple no innovation lol watch bands" statements should we suffer through as a community?

Fair enough. Yet I think you must ask yourself: Why does something become a successful meme?

I would argue that memes are, in effect, a form of data compression that condenses a (A) wide scope of information, that (B) many people feel is true into (C) a very small nugget of memorable text.

So, I could've spent a few paragraphs arguing the lack of meaningful product development, highlight the overlapping and often confusing product catalog (iPad, iPad Pro, iPad Pro 13", iPad Air, MacBook, MacBook Air, etc etc). Spent a few more sentences talking about Beats acquisition, Apple Music, etc....but in the end it saves everyone time to just say "Watch Bands + Stickers" and the meme imbues the rest.

I think you'd agree that its not the use of a meme that bothers you, but its the use of a meme that you don't agree with, yet still holds an uncomfortable truth in it.

For instance, if the meme was about how Elon Musk was upsetting the entrenched oil oligarchs, I doubt you'd want that censored.

I would love to hear your thoughts on their lack of meaningful product development, confusing product catalog, Beats Acquisition, etc.

Look I'm a huge Apple fanboy - no doubt, but at the same time I think the company is intrinsically interesting to try and understand from all different angles. They don't do a lot of things right and that's worth discussing. On the flip side they also do a lot of things very right, and that's also worth discussing. In fact, it's this very dichotomy that makes Apple...Apple, and Google...Google. Their incredible strengths are borne out of their very weaknesses, and these balances creates very different products.

But take Apple out of the equation. Let's just talk memes.

A lot of the things you mentioned are incredibly nuanced and make for fantastic discussions about branding, marketing, technology, privacy, platforms, org structures, etc. Memes effectively strip conversations of their nuance and conversation cannot be efficiently driven forward to a new level of understanding. That's my whole issue with this. It has nothing to do with whether I agree with your statement or not, and it has everything to do with what new ideas we can come up with together if we have a real, nuanced conversation. That applies to Elon Musk as well.

So bring on the paragraphs, it's not too late!

As a general comment I personally wouldn't mind if 1) moderation is a bit stricter, combined with 2) less of the 'nudging' type of moderation. Too often I click on a user's comment history and I find pages upon pages of almost fully greyed-out comments, or mostly comments that are not greyed out but (from my point of view, admittedly) unambiguously low-quality.

I enjoy HN and am thankful for the time spent on moderating it though, so it's a minor concern at this point.

They irony here being that attacking others isn't at all "something of substance".

Anger troll undermines anger troll

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