Hacker News Reader

Comment by ktzar | Hacker News Reader

I'm sorry, but people not having just a basic understanding of how debt works is not 'the system's problem.

After reading the article I can identify a few things that would've raised a huge red alarm in my head if it was me: - Don't spend $12k in holidays right after you're fired and have a couple kids. - C-Sections are quite normal these days... It'd great that you want to be with your wife and the new babies... If you can afford it! Most people can't. - Using loans that have an interest of 590% APR... Sorry, you have to be quite ignorant to sign that. Even the worst credit cards have an interest that's a fraction of that. That's definitely not cheap credit.

I know many Canadians... And people with that little financial knowledge is definitely not that common. And yes, most people take more debt than what they should, but the case portrayed in the article should give way to a very different headline "Couple chains badly financial decisions".

View on HN

Depends how you define the system, but if the system is the broader community, then I'd say it's the system's problem. A debt spiral isn't going to lead to happier people, crime-free communities, etc.

This ties back to something I've been saying for years: High School should include a basic course in financial education.

Understanding budgeting, interest on loans & credit card debt, how a mortgage works, saving for retirement, etc...

So that once you get into the real world, you aren't learning this stuff through trial and error.

It's this a million times. As a Canadian I've talked to a staggering number of people who don't understand finances or basic financial instruments. At best they end up terrified of anything so much as a credit card, and at worst they end up like the family in this story, just grasping whatever ill advised financial resources are available to live the life they feel is right.

My person pet complot theory is that this is because if they would teach even the basics of proper financials to future household runners the system would not be able to profit so handsomely of the victims.

I think sadly the assumption is that kids will learn about finances from their parents, but since so many adults also don't know enough about this (and often shield their children from the family's financials), that's a bad assumption to rely on.

We used to have that in Quebec when I was in high school (in the 90s) but they took it out a couple of years ago.

I remember doing budgets and figuring out how much it would cost to leave your parent's place, rent an apartment, buying fridge, furniture, etc. to help you prepare for being an adult.

They're talking about adding it back now.

Yes! It was called Family Economics, and was by far one of the best classes I've ever had.

They even taught you basic cooking and sewing. Our final cooking exam consisted of every team of 2 students being given 20$ and an hour and a half to go to the grocery store across the street, buy ingredients for a pizza and then cook it, without assistance from the teacher. You were graded on budget, teamwork, time taken and the quality of the cooking.

I still think that is a genius idea for an exam.

That's it, "Économie Familiale". We didn't have a grocery store near our school and don't remember that well but I think out school provided the ingredients, or maybe we brought them from home?

If you can read French, I found these documents that are interesting while researching the subject:

http://collections.banq.qc.ca/ark:/52327/bs1561252

http://collections.banq.qc.ca/ark:/52327/bs41338

The second one says it's approved by the Catholic and protestant counsel for superior education...? http://cse.gouv.qc.ca/FR/Historique/index.html

Huh we had Home Ec classes as well, but there was no financial planning or budget component to it, and it wasn't in high school it was in middle school..

Seems to make way more sense to have it in high school

I love hearing that, and I hope they do bring it back..

I was in high school in Ottawa in the early 90s and there was nothing like that.

> Sorry, you have to be quite ignorant to sign that. Even the worst credit cards have an interest that's a fraction of that. That's definitely not cheap credit.

Agreed, but sometimes that's the only hope some have. At one point in time, I did and I came from a very normal credit-worthy background. Shit happens, ktzar.

Maybe they're already maxxed-out? Or can't get a credit limit high enough to borrow what they need. Or need to pay something in cash, and don't have a higher limit available from a cash-out card. Or are "un-bankable"

That 590% is scoffed at, yet paid, because there's a majority of people (2M in Canada, according to the article) who have no other choice.

Most people would opt for the better option, if they had one.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com