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Comment by gambiting | Hacker News Reader

I'm not British but I live in the UK - I have based my entire life here, family, house, job, car, everything - and a year ago, I would have never considered leaving, this is my home. But right now, I'm weighting my options. I'm a huge believer in the European Union, so why would I want to live in a country that's not in it? And increasingly, I think the answer is - I wouldn't. So although I haven't started packing yet, if, for example, it turns out I have to get a visa to stay in the country that I consider my home, then I will most likely pack everything and leave to a different EU country that is more welcoming.

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I have had the pleasure over the last few years or working in the UK with so many excellent people from elsewhere in the EU - from Ireland, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Germany, Portugal to name a few.

It really upsets me that the inclusive welcoming culture that we used to have (not to mention the economic benefits) is being destroyed.

I'm in the opposite situation, living in Germany as a British national. Since the EU is likely to respond in kind to any actions it takes out against EU nationals in the UK, I'm probably going to face the same in return, and it scares the crap out of me.

I've built my life over here, have a family and I really don't want to be forced back to the UK away from my children.

At present I'm considering taking out German nationality since I've pretty much been here long enough to do so, but I'm not keen on being forced to give up my British citizenship as a result. Being British is a core part of my identity.

The goalposts have been moved and after being encouraged to take advantage of freedom of movement I now find myself up against the wall as a result. This stinks.

> I'm not keen on being forced to give up my British citizenship as a result. Being British is a core part of my identity.

I hear you.

I have two nationalities (German and Italian). If Germany would force me to choose between them, I'd probably remain German for practical reasons -- but at the same time, it would greatly alienate me from the German state. As opposed to what politicians claim: that it would strengthen my integration into German society.

Being part of two nations, two peoples, is just fundamentally who I am, and I insist on governments acknowledging it.

Fun fact: my children have three nationalities.

Getting a visa isn't so onerous is it? Compared with the hassle of upping your roots and moving your family?

I can't speak for gambiting, but I'm also going to leave the UK as a direct consequence of Brexit. It's not that it would be impossible to get some visa if I really wanted, it's that revoking the freedom of movement sends a strong signal that they don't want us here.

When I was choosing where I'd go for university, the UK wouldn't have even made the shortlist if moving here was even slightly more inconvenient than just walking in. The only thing the UK had going for it is that I already knew the language. There are plenty of other places in Europe where skilled labour is in demand.

Which is completely wrong. We have no problem with engineers, doctors and skilled people coming to the UK. We just don't want an open door policy where its free entry to EU migrants with no skills at all.

Let me ask you this, if the US or Canada offered you a job, would you refuse it as their requirement for a visa means they don't want you there?

I suspect a number of people do have problems with engineers, doctors and skilled people coming to the UK. The only question is how numerous those people really are.

Personally, I absolutely would refuse a job in US or Canada because it requires a visa. And there's a bit of a difference between requiring a visa on entry, and suddenly requiring a visa from someone who is fully settled in a country and didn't need a visa previously, don't you think?

From speaking to other EU nationals who've made their home in the UK it's more feeling like they're no longer welcome than the legal burden which is making them think about leaving.

It's a switch in the power structure. My wife is polish, working and living in germany. We don't need to ask for anything, no permissions for her to live here, to work, healthcare, taxes, all the same as for me. The most notable thing she can't do is vote in the national election (though she can vote in local elections). There is no interference from a government employee who may have a bad day - it's a right, not something you need to apply for.

Requiring a visa or a work permit would switch that around. It may expire and not be renewed for a formality. It certainly would make our live more miserable by introducing an extra element of uncertainty.

It might not be difficult to get one, but I'm fairly certain it would make me feel unwelcome. Right now I feel like I belong, thanks to EU freedom of movement I can come and go as I please - with a visa, it's never this easy, you are always questioned at the border, because you are not a citizen. My other concern is what will happen once my mum gets older and I will want her to come here so I can take care of her - I might get a visa as a working professional, but would they let her come? Again, I can live in any other EU country and just not have this problem, so it's definitely something I have to consider.

Recent events in my country (the US) have shown that visas don't really mean much of anything - here one day, gone the next. Most times they will be fine, but you can't trust them.

It just makes you feel more foreign though...You also have to consider deportation if the political environment changes or for some reasons you fail to extend your visa. That may give you a feel of insecurity and shortly said you may no longer feel "at home" anymore.

its just an instance of the classic overly emotional "these people dont want me here so fuck them, who are they to ask me to acquire a formality".

OP could just as well seek naturalization if hes actually spent his entire life there.

As a binational person, I can tell you that this is a much more emotional issue than you believe.

Being asked to leave your citizenship behind isn't just some paperwork, it's a very big blow to your identity. In my case, it would have almost no practical effect (I'm European either way), but it would be a huge issue.

It's kinda like marrying. You may claim that it's just paperwork (and I'm sure some people really feel that way), but I felt there was something more about it. Sure, I had been with my now-wife for eight years at that point, but being the act of marrying made it much more Serious (yes, capital S). If you've ever been married, maybe you can relate to that feeling.

He was naturalised.

If hes a citizen of the UK, he certainly wont need a visa to stay.

I can't get a British passport yet, even though I lived in UK for 7 years now. The earliest I can apply for one is in 3 years,so after brexit happens.

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