Comment by ilamont | Hacker News Reader

Comment by ilamont | Hacker News Reader

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Amazon does indeed print books through its Createspace print-on-demand division. It’s been used by hundreds of thousands of self-publishers but also indie presses seeking to sell additional copies without investing in a big offset print run.

If the pirate attempted to use an existing ISBN (required to match up the listings) I am pretty sure Createspace would automatically flag it [ETA: Not so sure anymore. See http://www.kboards.com/index.php/topic,248831.msg3466774.htm...]. There is no Amazon or Createspace branding applied to the book; the only clue that it’s POD is a barcode on the last blank page with “Made In USA” (digital short run and offset do not have to do this).

Another POD service, Ingramspark, also feeds into Amazon via third-party sellers but there will definitely be a block if an existing ISBN is used.

Another possibility is the pirates are using the POD services and a different ISBN, then make the Amazon listing using the original ISBN and ship the copy themselves (that is, not using fulfillment by Amazon). They could sticker over the bogus ISBN or not; nobody except for victims bothers to check.

Or, perhaps the pirates are using a cheap independent digital short run service and put whatever they want on the cover (printers don’t care) and then sell it on Amazon as the real thing.

In the case of the counterfeit copies of Linux Command Line sold through Amazon, those were printed by CreateSpace in violation of copyright. That is certain. From what we can tell that is also the case here.

This is terrible. The infuriating thing is if Amazon actually does anything, the scammers still get off with no penalty other than having their seller and Createspace accounts suspended.

If you don't mind me asking, is there a POD block printed on the bottom of the last blank page? Typically it's a barcode and something like "Printed in USA, Lexington KY" and the date.

Also on the Twitter thread someone mentioned that the contents were copied from a PDF you sell on the site -- are they the same press-ready PDFs used for the book, or PDFs formatted for 8.5 x 11? I ask because we sell PDFs too for letter-sized paper, and I always assumed it would be difficult to pirate for a 6x9 how-to guide.

I haven't seen these counterfeits. I've only seen the photos. The first counterfeit looked like it was printed from our PDF but it's hard to tell. There's a bar code on the back but not the POD code you're referring to. But we know the first one was printed and sold by them. About 1200 copies.

If there is no POD code on the last blank page, it might not be Createspace, because they (as well as other US providers such as IngramSpark and Lightning Source) have to include it.

It's possible it's someone doing digital short run and then selling it as a third party seller. If the price is low enoughI think that helps them get the buy box.

Interestingly Kindle Direct Publishing does/did do some sort of content check. They flagged me because some of the book content in something I was publishing a few years back was adapted from various blog posts that I had written. I just had to send them some links and confirm that I was the copyright holder or otherwise had rights to use the material.

As far as I remember though, the same book wasn't flagged by Createspace.

I seem to recall an article that exposed Kindle authors who plagiarized old trade paperback romance novels and sold them for a profit, which might be why Kindle Direct Publishing does check content.

There's nothing wrong with selling public domain works for profit in general. (KDP has some restrictions - https://kdp.amazon.com/help?topicId=A2OHLJURFVK57Q) Were those authors pretending they were original works?

That actually makes sense although, in practice, it's still a bit of a mess. They basically don't want a bunch of 25 cent versions of public domain books clogging up the site in various forms of unreadability that don't add anything to the free versions.

Depends on how amazon's lawyers looked at it. I suspect they assumed that section 230 of the CDA, and the DMCA would cover them. However because physical paper copies are being generated that voids both the protections provided by both laws. Amazon is most likely criminally and civilly liable here.

I am not a lawyer and nothing here should be considered legal advice merely personal opinion

While I'm not a lawyer either, my understanding is that neither section 230 of the CDA nor the DMCA safe harbour provide protection for companies that actually sell copyright-infringing works, regardless of whether they're digital or physical.

IANAL also, but to get criminal case here a prosecutor would have to do something like find an email from an Amazon executive saying "let's keep selling fakes."

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