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Comment by mememachine | Hacker News Reader

>There are clearly cases in which attempting to stand up to abusive behaviour has the potential to cause more problems (at the very least in the short term) than by staying silent

You seem to be confusing "standing up to abuse" and "indicating that behavior is abusive." The second is very risk-free and what I demand from anyone who wants to call themselves a victim.

Again, it doesnt have to be verbal. But if youre making a special effort to hide it, I dont sympathize.

In other words, if your "abuser" is reasonably unaware, for whatever reason, that you view their behavior as abusive, then you lose victim status.

I want to go further with this. Just because youre uncomfortable, doesnt mean its unreasonable discomfort. Youre getting paid to WORK, which is by its nature uncomfortable. Often times "stop being a whiney bitch" is accurate (although obviously usually inappropriate.)

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My problem with your comment is the entitlement you claim to define acceptable behaviour of those being abused "what I demand from anyone who wants to call themselves a victim". Also people don't want to call themselves victims, they are victims who may feel able to make that known.

Letting a bully know that they are having an effect on you is far from risk free.

You also seem to believe that people have no responsibility for making people around them comfortable unless they are explicitly told it is making them uncomfortable. Everyone has a responsibility not to be ass.

>You also seem to believe that people have no responsibility for making people around them comfortable unless they are explicitly told it is making them uncomfortable. Everyone has a responsibility not to be ass.

I do not believe this.

>My problem with your comment is the entitlement you claim to define acceptable behaviour of those being abused "what I demand from anyone who wants to call themselves a victim". Also people don't want to call themselves victims, they are victims who may feel able to make that known.

Well if they want my sympathy those are my standards, sorry.

And by the way this:

>Also people don't want to call themselves victims, they are victims who may feel able to make that known.

Is not remotely true.

>>You also seem to believe that people have no responsibility for making people around them comfortable unless they are explicitly told it is making them uncomfortable. Everyone has a responsibility not to be ass.

>I do not believe this.

Let's take this further. If your coworker pulled you aside and punched you every day when you came into work, would you say they were justified as long as you didn't tell them you didn't want that to happen?

If this person were your boss and you were afraid you'd be ostracized or fired if you spoke up, are you not a victim?

At what point can we agree that behavior is worthy of condemnation without needing to explicitly be told that it's not okay?

If that isn't what you believe you aren't clearly expressing what you do believe and what responsibilities people, particularly senior people do have.

Most who come forward aren't asking for sympathy but reporting what has happened to them. What I would ask is for you to stand up if you witness inappropriate behaviour.

Some may want the abuse recognised but they all wish they weren't victims. Going public is tough, main reasons to do it are to protect others by either changing the organisation or just waning likely victims away. You stating "Is not remotely true" does not a reasonable argument make, at least put some description behind your opposing thesis.

You say people should indicate when behavior is inappropriate.

Notice the disagreement and downvotes. That's telling you your behavior is inappropriate.

Perhaps you should reconsider your position on the issue.

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