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Comment by ronjouch | Hacker News Reader

FUD. I do use the features you are mentioning, but encounter none of the issues. Thinkpad + Arch user.

We Linux users need to realize we are an island, and it's our duty to:

- Either Linux-QA-check on our own / as a community the hardware we're buying before we buy, because the constructor isn't doing it (it's doing it for the actively supported OS, Windows).

- Or buy {System76 / Thinkpad}, and get {a lot of / some} help from the constructor.

EDIT: agreed that Mac hardware quality is miles ahead though, not contradicting you on this specific point.

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Dismissing anecdotes about failure as FUD is not constructive. FUD is first and foremost a business tactic.

Sure, anecdotes aren't necessarily that useful. For every happy Mac user there seems to be an angry one who always had hardware problems, for example. But it's not exactly news that Linux has issues with hardware compatibility. It's the nature of the beast, really; Apple is able to target a very specific configuration, whereas Linux has to work on any old crappy Windows PC.

> "Dismissing anecdotes about failure as FUD is not constructive. FUD is first and foremost a business tactic."

Hm, reading {your, UnoriginalGuy, mwfunk} comments, I realize "FUD" is a loaded term. I was using it literally, missing the strong stuff associated with it. Point taken, thanks.

+1 Thinkpad+Fedora user here... things have never been better.

I'd also try out an XPS-13 if I could afford it; but my $300 second-hand x230 works like a charm for now.

> FUD.

That's a very disrespectful way of starting a post. In particular as you conclude that you largely agree with them. So which is it, they're spreading "Fear, uncertainty and doubt" or they're right? In either case, seems unconstructive.

> So which is it, they're spreading "Fear, uncertainty and doubt" or they're right?

They're spreading the FUD that Linux laptop hardware support is frustrating, no questions asked. It's FUD because it's a fear-inducing oversimplification of the current state of things, which is that Linux laptop hardware support is enjoyable -if you do your homework-.

It's not FUD by definition because they are literally talking about their personal experiences. FUD is a form of astroturfing. FUD is knowingly and intentionally dishonest, by definition. If you're going to immediately sink to that level, why bother with FUD accusations- just go full Slashdot and accuse them of shilling for some company you don't like because of some random tribal affiliation.

I think the point was that most would rather just have a machine that works out of the box so they can do their actual work instead of 'doing their homework' on how to get their machine to hibernate, connect to wifi reliably, etc...

You're re-framing the context of "doing their homework".

I agree you shouldn't be doing any homework to perform basic tasks such as "get [the] machine to hibernate, connect to wifi reliably, etc...". I'm not doing any of it on my Thinkpad, where these tasks work without messing around.

And in an ideal world, yes, I'd love not having to ever think about it too :) . But in the current Windows-dominated non-Mac consumer hardware world, what I say is that you should be doing homework prior to buying a machine you expect to install Linux on.

OP meant on what machine to buy (something you'd probably do before buying a Windows laptop anyway). But if like me can't be bothered with even this then just buy a system 76 or an xps with ubuntu pre-installed... No homework required.

Having to do your homework rather than it working out of the box is frustrating.

From your perspective, maybe. But it's a very close minded thing to say.

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