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Comment by sunny16 | Hacker News Reader

Just want to clarify something here- I think guys too often assume that the "jerk" part of "cocky jerk" is somehow a key component of getting the girl. It's not. The confidence is the important part. A confident, nice guy has just as much of a chance with a girl as a confident, mean guy. I would argue he has a better chance.

The term "Nice Guy" describes a guy who thinks he is being "gentlemanly" when really he's just being shy. I think it's important to distinguish kindness from confidence, lest we all start treating women poorly in an effort to get them to sleep with us.

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I disagree to some extent. Men who are successful at being jerks are successful because they're confident. A man can be confident and not a jerk, and the reaction will for some women also be effective, but the reaction will definitely be different. It depends on what the woman is looking for. If she's looking for excitement and something casual, I think the evidence shows that being a jerk is a lot more effective. If she wants a husband, being nice is a lot more effective. But for the most part, you're not going to have much success at cold-openings with women by trying to appeal to their desire to find a husband.

Being "a jerk" to a woman signals that you don't especially value her. It puts her in a frame of mind that you yourself must be valuable to not value her or fawn over her like lots of men do. It makes her chase you instead of you chasing her (which is boring because women get that all the time).

Confidence is what makes it work, but I don't think it's the confidence alone.

Since we're now wandering in to "pick-up artist" territory, it is actually often argued that "coming from a place of abundance" is one of the key factors. In other words, you like hanging out with the woman, and you will entertain her and yourself by being yourself. However you will not do any of these things from an ulterior motive of taking her home, you simply take actions guiding the outcome towards that if you feel like it. Otherwise you are perfectly content to enjoy the moment, as it is.

And if it doesn't work out, you're perfectly fine with that as well. Your mental state is undamaged, and you're not signaling lack of value because you fall into desperation when "the only woman" (the one you worked so hard for!) you're with is leaving.

I would argue (probably strongly influenced by others, RSDTyler mainly [1]), that it is easier to be "false confident" as a "jerk", and signal abundance in that way, than to have true confidence based in the actions you take every day, and the life that you live. That is why we've seen this stereotype of the jerk getting the girl. However this jerk might not be a good fit for a relationship (and neither is the "nice guy" sucking up to the girl with an ulterior motive), as they will not be able to stay centered and confident over a longer period of time.

However it is probably easier to detect the "nice guy" and weed him out, than the jerk, as that more closely resembles true confidence.

Interestingly enough, having true confidence means you kinda come full-circle and end up being a person with clearly defined boundries and probably a clear driving force in your life. Thereby turning into a more interesting person, and a better "mating partner".

Interesting sources:

https://www.amazon.com/Way-Superior-Man-Spiritual-Challenges...

https://www.amazon.com/Models-Attract-Women-Through-Honesty-...

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/user/RSDTyler

[2]: The most engaged, but least attached: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWaDDCjuM0w

The "Confident Jerk" gets the girl mythos comes from men who are just plain jerks but believe themselves to be nice. When confronted with rejection from women, they rely on this mythos to displace blame for their own behavior onto the woman instead.

"It's not me, it's a lack of judgement in her gender!"

That very thought in and of itself defines one as a jerk, imo. Of course people like and prefer to be around nice people.

Yours and the comment you're replying to sound so reductive. People are different. They like other people for lots of different reasons that can't be reduced to a single trait or even a handful of traits. There are 7 billion people on this planet, and you are both generalizing this stuff to the moon.

I made a point to qualify everything I said.

"some women", "women often say", "all the time" (instead of every time), "predictable"

There are 7 billion people, and even if it's 7 billion unique snowflakes, they're still all snowflakes. We're more alike than we are different. This is especially true when you boil it down to young, unmarried, childless, American women who are social and go to places where they can meet men. These are the women whose opinion on a man's approach matter the most in the context of dating advice. Sure, these women are all unique in their own ways, but they are not very unique in what they find attractive in men.

Neither parent comment even insinuated that what they said applied to all people. You're seeing phantom generalizations.

Confidence and attractiveness. I sincerely doubt the researchers were being able to replicate attractiveness before the experiment took place.

Not true, being a jerk works

It does with certain personality types. Read about attachment styles. I would suggest not going after those people unless they can compensate for it.

Anyway, one might overestimate the amount of jerks in this world out of jealousy of those who are more confident.

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