Hacker News Reader

Comment by eggy | Hacker News Reader

It's crazy to spend that much time in jail for a nonviolent offense, and such a small amount of substance in the US.

The war on drugs is a big waste of many things. But to put it in perspective, I am currently living in SE Asia where you are informed by airline announcements and signs that drug trafficking is punishable by death in several of the countries here!

I'm from Brooklyn, but I live in Indonesia now. I'm currently in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. 138 Nigerians are awaiting death penalties in China, Malaysia, Indonesia and Singapore at this time.

View on HN

You forgot the Philippines. President Duterte has summarily executed nearly 2,000 suspected drug dealers and users since July 1st and vowed to execute 98,000 more.

http://time.com/4462352/rodrigo-duterte-drug-war-drugs-phili...

How are the words "executed" and "suspected" in the same sentence?!

The Philippines even gets a mention in the Wikipedia entry on summary execution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summary_execution

It's basically mob justice over there, AFAICT

The president literally said in a speech, regarding what to do if you suspect someone of dealing drugs: "Please feel free to call us, the police, or do it yourself if you have the gun — you have my support"

Yeah, and when I was over in Indonesia for a month a while back, I even had randos thinking I was an Aussie tourist and trying to sell me pills, weed, etc. on the street. Sorry buddy, but as much as I might love to roll up a spliff out on the beach this evening, I don't feel like either getting set up by some crooked scam where I end up having to give some cop all my money to let me go or, worse, end up in some prison for buying and possessing some cannabis or shitty E.

Needless to say, I stuck to the Bintang.

It wasn't an 'offense' it was plural 'offenses' as in three. And we aren't talking about personal possession we are talking about intent to distribute. The distinction between these are night and day.

I read that, and I get your point, but LSD, or marijuana, to me are not in the same league as heroin or cocaine and the amounts those are usually traded in along with the gangs and violence associated with them. I'm not at all addressing the law; I am expressing surprise over the extreme sentence in comparison to what I think are worse crimes. Rapists get what, 4 years in the US if prosecuted? There were/are people serving life sentences over marijuana sales, and now it's legal in some states.

But there are two different things - selling and using. Using is only marginally criminalized. Selling and distributing is a much more serious offense. Alcohol in some ways is no different. I can home brew all I want and bottle it and put it in the refrigerator. If throw the garage door open and start selling it to the general public I can expect some trouble from the legal system. Crossing state boundaries and using a Federal system like the mail further compounded this individual's situation.

I can assure rapists don't get 4 years and they are almost always prosecuted if there is enough evidence.

You can't assure rapists don't get 4 years (or less):

> The convictions carried a potential sentence of 14 years in prison. Prosecutors recommended six years in prison while probation officials recommended a "moderate" county jail sentence.[19] On June 2, 2016, Santa Clara County Superior Court Judge Aaron Persky sentenced Turner to six months confinement in the Santa Clara County jail to be followed by three years of probation.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/People_v._Turner

But he was NOT convicted and sent to prison for rape, it was sexual assault and in some states penal systems those are different crimes with different sentencing guidelines:

"On October 7, 2015, after reviewing the results of DNA tests, the two rape charges were dropped by prosecutors.[7][12][14][15] The trial began on March 14, 2016,[16] and concluded on March 30, 2016, with Turner's conviction on the three remaining charges of felony sexual assault."

Please show me one single rape conviction in the US where the sentence was 4 years.

How does someone downvote another for presenting a fact? What I have learned from Hackernews is at this point is not to participate in non-technical discussions. As they are mostly just mob mentality. How do you downvote someone that took the time to participate in a discussion? Its amazing to see that every single comment I have made in this discussion has been downvoted? I've said nothing outrageous, I have offered different points of view? I have taken the time to articulate myself and every single comment is downvoted?

BTW, I didn't downvote you.

I think you are splitting hairs here on rape. OK, 8 years average conviction on rape, if the victim pursues it. Still 8 years with possible time off for good behavior on a very violent crime vs. Selling LSD -> life sentence. I still fail to see aside from the law how you think the punishment is in proportion to the actions, which was the point I was trying to convey.

Well I'm not sure someone serving 8 years vs 4 years would agree with you. Its double the amount, I'm not sure I would say that's splitting hairs. Time off is a fact of many sentences in an overcrowded penal system.

I never stated that I agreed with the sentencing guidelines, which I absolutely and emphatically do not. What I said was that there was a reason in the eyes of the law for using weight including paper as metric. Whether you agree with it or not that's their logic. I never said anything more.

I guess that simply pointing that out there was another side to this was enough for being downvoted as if I am some "tough on crime, law and order" Republican?

That's unfortunate because it was a topic that I thought was interesting and a case that I have actually kept up on over the years.

I think your arguments were rational. Splitting hairs is not the difference between 4 or 8 years, but compared to life, or around 60 to 75 years depending on your incarceration age. I do agree with you pointing out that it was a multiple offense, and selling not buying to use. Still, life? And questions of mental health too.

"According to a pre-sentencing memorandum, Tyler was charged with selling 13,000 hits of acid, found on 13 sheets of paper and equivalent to several grams of liquid. Tyler pleaded guilty to drug distribution...."

Wikipedia. Plus the two prior offenses.

And here I was looking at the title and thinking they'd outlawed the Dead.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com