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Comment by tombert | Hacker News Reader

The part I find especially frustrating is that, on average, a New Yorker has a lower carbon footprint than the typical American, probably due to the heavy use of the train.

So even when I do the (I think) eco-friendly thing by not having a car and using public transit, I'm still being punished for what the rest of the US (and the rest of the world) does.

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Even with your slightly lower footprint due to not owning a car you still have a much larger footprint than the world mean. Probably 2-3x. So there are billions of people being "punished" for what you're doing.

Well, considering that I get my power from a combination of Nuclear and wind power, I doubt that I give a particularly high carbon footprint.

But you're not wrong, I almost certainly have a higher footprint than most of the third world.

I guess what I was getting at is that I think the levels New York has are substantially more sustainable than the rest of the US. Sorry for the confusion.

I would guess your footprint is more increased by getting all kinds of stuff (you don't really need). And the stuff being shipped across half the globe.

That's a fair point and I'll admit I hadn't considered that.

Conceivably, we could make electric (or something) transportation systems that can travel across the world and not produce and CO2, but we certainly haven't gotten there yet.

Marine transport is incredibly efficient. Total marine transport accounts for ~2% of global CO2 emission. It would be nice to have, but definitely a low priority.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_shippi...

Do you have any data to back up your claim that New York is "substantially more sustainable than the rest of the US"? I'd be genuinely curious to look at that data

It's not terribly hard to find data on NYC's carbon footprint per capita: http://www.eia.gov/environment/emissions/state/analysis/

From the article: "New York, with a population of 19.6 million people, had the lowest per capita CO2 emissions – 8 mt per capita. A large portion of the population is located in the New York City metropolitan area where mass transit is readily available and most residences are multi-family units that provide efficiencies of scale in terms of energy for heating and cooling."

Don't forget to include the chemical energy you use to run your body in your figure for "my power." The impact from agriculture is pretty substantial.

I don't like the word "punished" in this climate context.

I don't either. Hence my use of scare quotes.

I think you and i share a similar line of thought. I'm trying to rack my brain (and contribute something) as when (other eras) in history has the "regard of future generations" cause for such debate or action like this one.

Nobody can predict if another person's life will be better if "x" happens. This is a foundation of suicide prevention.

How much Carbon did it take to make New York into New York? That's "your Carbon" too if we are going to talk about "punishment"

That's just the wrong language and maybe the wrong perspective, we are all in this together when it comes to climate change, we all pay for the sins of others.

Even more troubling: we are being punished by what the world did, generations past.

This stuff has, by our standards, long delayed effects.

The implication is disconcerting: a FULL STOP of excessive green house gas emissions right now will have, at best, a notable impact in several decades.

Without all the stuff generations past did you might still be living in a cave and hunting and gathering for food.

All in, the gains you've received from your ancestors FAR FAR outweigh the losses.

I don't know really what you're arguing. I don't think that the poster was suggesting that we go back to the flintstones-age, and I'm sure he/she was appreciative of the work that's been done in the past, but that in no way deters from the fact that current and future generations are going to have to do a lot of cleanup from the past generations.

If your parents died and left you an inheritance of $1000 and also a debt of $100 you're still $900 ahead. Most people wouldn't call that being "punished."

Oh, I totally get that society has benefited from our 150 years focus on using the concentrated energy found in the ground.

The hell of it is that we've only had a reasonable understanding of the dangers associated with using this energy for a few decades. I find no fundamental fault associated with their decisions back in the day.

If you enjoy traveling by air at least once a year, you pollute far, far more than the average person in the US or the world.

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