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Comment by codingdave | Hacker News Reader

"everything that matters" is quite subjective. I live in the mountains, with endless outdoor activity within minutes of my place. I can drive to 8 national parks and monuments in half a day. I have a great place to raise my kids, and I am NOT surrounded by tech events and meetups... I am surrounded by people who like to spend our free time outside. All of those things matter to me.

So whether or not Silicon Valley is important to you has everything to do with what you value in life. As the article said, there is a big generation gap here. I'm an older coder who doesn't give a crap how many opportunities are around because I only need one at a time. And with remote work becoming ever more prevalent, I just don't foresee ever having a desire to move to SV.

I live where I can lead the life I want, not work the job I want.

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That pretty much describes where I live in Berkeley. I'm within easy walking distance of some nice short hikes and reasonable driving distance of more intense hikes or rock climbing. It's not literally in the mountains but there are some pretty incredible hills, forests and, of course, ocean beaches.

I also don't see how being "NOT surrounded" by tech events could possibly be a good thing. If you're not interested, you don't have to go. It's not like tech is forced on everyone! But if you suddenly feel like going to an engaging talk—whether it's on a JS framework or on combinatorial game theory—you always have the option. You wouldn't have that choice otherwise.

> I also don't see how being "NOT surrounded" by tech events could possibly be a good thing. If you're not interested, you don't have to go.

The monoculture of "tech" is a grind after you visit other places. The Bay Area is a fine place if you get excited by networking events and like asking people at a bar about their deck, but I find it mind-numbing.

It was one of the primary reasons I left SF for NYC. There is still world-class tech employment to be found here, but it is surrounded by world-class industries of all other kinds, too.

My tech employee friends in NYC, who work for respected names and are great at what they do, don't spend weekends at hackathons or weeknights running from tech office to tech office for free food at meetups. Here, it is okay and even normal to finish a work day and go experience art, culture, history, etc... things which all do exist in SF and are often great quality there, for sure, but which in certain employment circles seem to be pretty much ignored.

To each their own.

NYC has some pretty brutal work life balance expectations in pretty much every industry I've talked to people from.

Outside of SV startups, many companies in the Bay have reasonable hours. There is definitely a workaholic expectation in NYC.

That's a common sentiment, but woefully exaggerated: it's not like the Bay Area is only tech. I mean, it's not New York, but neither is anywhere else in the country. The Bay Area has all the art and culture and music you'd expect of a cosmopolitan city, it has the same generic business/sales/finance/law professionals, it has two of the best universities in the country. It has everything you'd get elsewhere and tech.

It's a perfectly diverse metropolitan area with tech as an addition, not as a replacement. That's strictly more than many other cities I've spent time in from Ottawa to Charlotte. Calling it a monoculture is simply not accurate or, if it is, so many cities don't have even that.

Ehh, I don't think it's exaggerated at all - having lived both in SF and NYC.

There exists things that aren't tech in SF, but the scale of which is much lower than other major cities like NYC. More importantly though, even in non-tech scenes, tech is always there. It's the guy at the party that seems to find you no matter how much you move around the room. I found it suffocating - no matter where you go you can never fully disengage from the industry.

The measure of a tech monoculture isn't (IMO) the existence of other things, it's whether or not tech tags along with all of these other things.

Right, because that's the only thing to do in the Bay Area.

There are plenty of cultural events in SF not involving tech. Museums, art shows, live music, etc.

Yes, those things also exist in every other city and they [mostly] manage to do it without the hordes of brogrammers.

I agree with your general point, but it sounds like you have a very one dimensional understanding of what the bay area is.

> I can drive to 8 national parks and monuments in half a day. I have a great place to raise my kids, and I am NOT surrounded by tech events and meetups... I am surrounded by people who like to spend our free time outside.

Literally all of this is true of the bay area, pretty much as soon as you stop living in the densest urban part of it (and even then, for some people: my cousins are raising a kid in the city and they love it, including the ability to drive to tons and tons of different state and national parks).

Sure, and more power to you I think it's awesome that you are happy where you are, but that really doesn't have anything to do with an argument about Silicon Valley losing its luster. The bay area is a great place for someone who wants to work in technology, in fact I can't think of a better place. There are lots and lots of outdoors things to do, but if that's what you want it doesn't really have anything to do with tech and where people in tech work in my opinion.

You can drive to 8 national parks and monuments in half a day from SF.

I live in northern Italy, half a day trip include most of the peninsula and southern France.

Sure job opportunityes are few, especially of the interesting kind, and pay is awful, but overall it's very hard to beat.

I don't really get the point of people pretending it's for the entartainment, especially if whatever you do starts with a three hours drove to get out of the urban area.

That doesn't really sound a high quality lifestyle, but to each their own.

> to get out of the urban area.

To get out of the suburban sprawl..

1/2 day is 4-5 hours. Try and list 8 parks.

7, but redwood national park is just too far. All without traffic of course.

Kings Canyon Sequoia Yosemite Lassen Volcanic Pinnacles Muir Woods Point Reyes

Even ignoring traffic, you are counting the same park multiple times. Kings Canyon, Sequoia, Yosemite, Lassen Volcanic, Pinnacles is not bad but it's not 8.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:NationalParks.forwiki.pdf

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_national_parks_of_the_...

But, Muir Woods is part of Golden Gate National Recreation Area and Point Reyes are not separate parks.

Two more national monuments I did not know about. Not parks. Was fun to see what's near by.

http://www.blm.gov/ca/st/en/prog/nlcs/California_Coastal_NM....

http://www.fs.fed.us/visit/berryessa-snow-mountain-national-...

Don't forget Henry Coe State Park.

Sounds awesome, where do you live?

Looking at this:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/3f/bb/7f/3fbb7f0fe...

I'm thinking Seattle area is likely.

Nah, Central Utah -- there are also a couple national monuments nearby that are not shown on that map.

I lived in Utah for three years and also loved the national parks and outdoor activities, but the culture (i.e. heavy Mormon influence) was pretty unbearable.

Out of curiosity, what did you find unbearable about the culture?

I've lived in both places (SLC, the Four Corners, SF, Menlo Park) and spent many weeks at a time in Delta, UT, in addition to places in New Mexico.

I'd love to live in Torrey and I'd move back to SLC if I could get a job in an industry that doesn't suck, but all things considered I'd take the bay area over anywhere in Utah.

"I am surrounded by people who like to spend our free time outside."

Spending free time outside pretty much defines the bay area. We're here because it's always sunny and not too hot so we can spend our time outside.

I think they meant spending time in the outdoors, not spending time drinking an $8 IPA on a patio, or going to the rooftop deck of Facebook for a hackathon.

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