zlatan_todoric

We are not the same ecosystem as Windows Phone and we will use different tech than they did - and even if we fail (which I don't think at all), it is part of life, work.

And for the end user - I don't think community failed, it just didn't have the multibillion dollar marketing machine behind it and also GNU/Linux commercial activities went into server and rarely into end user app, we plan to change this.

KDE community is awesome and all they needed to revive things around plasma mobile effort is to have dedicated device and with Librem5 they would get exactly that.

In first wave we plan to have couple of working apps such as dialer, mail, browser, audio/video player but gradually community will hop on and port/create apps for it.

Sure, we start against millions of apps in other ecosystem but on average people don't use more than 20 apps often and I for one dislike that every website out there has created their own iOS/Android app when I can simply use one app for all them - browser.

Also never underestimate the power of GNU/Linux community - it has by far most of hackers on it and it is doing their thing for decades already without slowing down at any single point.

Also, we will try to help and support any community that will work on getting their OS/app on Librem 5. It would be phone produced by Purism and supported by us, but it would truly be one from people for people. :)

Purism CTO here. I will not comment other but I can say for ours - you get it preinstalled with coreboot (which will also get updates as it progresses), all works out of the box with Free software (we preinstall on it PureOS but you can install any distro out there). Touchpad was an issue in past but we changed now and have quite a good touchpad that just works. The case is anodized aluminum. All Purism Librems have hardware kill switches - which means you can disable physically mic/camera and wifi/bt. Backlit keyboard is now on all models if that is something you like. Also with every buy you support our ongoing development such as neutralizing entirely ME, reverse engineering missing bits, creating our own firmware, developing PureOS as well as having better and better product (also if suddenly there would be thousands and thousands of orders, it would put price down).

P.S. because there is no Free software for Bluetooth (for WiFi/BT module) we have it disabled by default which means you would not be hit by latest Bluetooth exploit :D

To be honest, you can't say that was much more polished product soft+hardware as they never made one.

On the other hand, if they could raise 12mil I don't see why wouldn't people back this to 1.5 and more. While it certainly will have its issues we certainly can produce such device and it is going to be alternative.

There are a lot of failed FLOSS hardware tries but people should never give up hope and as said, we can produce this one for sure and by we I mean entire community - FLOSS people and devs, average Joe's, people who care about privacy, security and freedom of them, their families and friends and people who are simply fed up with iOS/Android state.

We certainly will invest heavily into one DE (upon successful campaign that decision will be made) but we will also work with all interested parties and devote some resources to get other up (it is the same in case someone is trying to bring up other OS or DE, we will try to help such effort as much as we can). The point is to give to community working Free phone and finally disrupt the status quo.

Server capacity reached , please try again later :) Tried the Debian instance

Adding nVidia and AMD GPUs would require us to have nonfree drivers or firmwares so that would be against our philosophy. Also adding proprietary stuff is against our goal of creating secure yet convenient OS (we try to free or create things that people need, not close them down even more).

We do this with our products https://puri.sm/learn/hardware-kill-switches/ although it would be really good to get more players into same field.

Oh great, they are catching up with Wire (https://wire.com/).

Now if they would just resolve real bugs (like many people not being able to register to Signal), that would be maybe cool (but as they implemented Signal Protocol to WhatsApp and others (if we can trust code we can't see) I can't say I see any point in it).

Maybe I am wrong, but it lost that appeal it had some time in past.

hah, indeed (I can reproduce it here as well). It would be interesting to report it to Firefox

Well, that would work if people/government don't break treaties of all kind on daily basis. Solution must be in roots not a patch on top of pile (of bullshit we created over time)

Ramen. We really need to get into primary schools subjects such as meditation, ethics, moral and "care for humanity" instead of having people get educated to go into military and "drool over weapons to kill more effectively".

Being a Debian Developer I can't recommend enough to artist to join the project and help with its visual identity.

Yet another proprietary social network. No thank you, I will stick with Diaspora* as it is already really good.

If you really love people you would be open and not create another walled garden/closed ecosystem.

CTO of Purism here.

We have 10" which is the affordable option (4GB RAM, 64GB SSD, Intel Atom Quad Core).

We know that prices are a bit high, but to maintain some supply chain stability we currently have to go this way. Once we would hit bigger numbers of orders, things and prices change quite a bit.

So person who assassinated an Archduke from a country that occupied his is - dumb?

Well, that is insult to many freedom fighters and with your logic creating of US is "revolutions of dumb people". For your information (I suggest go read because you obviously didn't) - Austria wanted a war, the assassination was just a good cause for them. The assassination happened in Bosnia (in territory they annexed) but they gave ultimatum to other sovereign state (Serbia) to conclude investigation with their own force on a soil of independent nation - I wonder what would happen if Turkey wanted to send its own investigators to conclude independent investigation of dead Turk in Germany.

For Serbs G.Princip was freedom fighter - Bosnia historically was Serbian land (Raska), most of muslims come from Serbs converted to Islam, and today half of Bosnia is entity called Republic of Srpska - Austria really had no business to be there in first place.

Your reasoning is simple terrible and shouldn't be on HN at all. Ever.

With your logic we could just say "Wars simple happen because of humans - so first humans on Earth are responsible for all wars".

Go educate yourself a bit before just commenting.

"I refuse to be bound by software I cannot negotiate with".

You're more than welcome to donate to Free software projects developing those tools and ask for a feature.

I don't think you understood what he meant. AFAICT he said that there is not that big fragmentation considering how big community is - and not that everyone should use different OS. Maybe people do care less about OS choice than car choice but that doesn't mean it is less important.

Btw, people from almost any domain represent small minority compared to seven billion people.

Bill Gates? Really? His company is one of the biggest proprietary companies in the world that to this day are still venturing into people's privacy as standard.

Also:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1371608/Bill-Gates-t...

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2012/03/0...!

http://www.crisismagazine.com/2013/the-ambitions-of-bill-and...

...

Maybe you want to take a look at https://taiga.io/

I meant an overkill as an excellent solution atm (sorry for not being precise - non-native here ;)

And Whonix atop of Qubes would probably be an overkill atm.

https://www.whonix.org/wiki/Qubes

First of all (repeating myself again): there is a lot of documentation out there (already mentioned multiple times in this thread) how you can build debs quickly. Also, Debian tutorials are Debian tutorials and they should serve Debian primarily and not some third-party, but still you have all documentation on Debian wiki (and also manpages of specific packages) - you just need to do a bit of search.

Second: saying that Debian's tutorials are less useful because they have specific goal of high quality - makes me really sad. Debian is community and not corporation, so to see that community has higher standard then any corporation should be praised. Also Debian's packaging evolved over 20+ years by thousands of hackers (experts in their field) all over world in their unique collaboration. I am sure this should be taken as a pride that you can go on net an read such tutorials.

And really, if someone thinks he is technical but can't read few pages of not so demanding tutorial, then problem is in them because in software world you evolve every day and need to read and code a lot to keep a pace. Only problem that you could say is that maybe isn't that fun to read (because Debian wikis are old school so the sentences stretch through entire screen while today's web is focused on centering all which makes it a bit easy to read and so on).

Debian packaging guides are less useful because they concentrate on how to build package for Debian?

And nobody is hiding from you any tutorial - Debian is an open community and the wiki is open to everyone so you can search for what you need but I really don't see the point in your sentences (are you saying that we should favorite somehow quick and dirty hacks instead of our strict high-quality ways of building packages? Because if yes, then Debian wouldn't be what it is today...)

what insults?

Again, QA is part of Debian packaging (just check all the debian lintian checks https://lintian.debian.org/tags-all.html - and you do officially run lintian on your packages).

Again, no one is forcing you to do official Debian packaging if you want to create simple deb for your purposes and it was mentioned in this thread by other and me several times (and several tools).

You see, there is where you mistake. Debian official packaging is about Quality of package. Lintian checks for example is your library really a library or it maybe contains scripts, did you make a mistake in description (simple letter mistake), did you miss new copyright files (or change in copyright of the same). There is also a reason why it suggests building in clean chroots, installation in same clean environment. You also have piuparts to check it's transition. Debian packaging is a huge thing and it would take me quite a time to explain it and I would still miss something. Also our packaging assumes that not all upstreams make sane coding or installation scripts so we detect them before just pushing them into system.

As you said, Arch could have all that but it doesn't and there are the reason why people who use Debian don't use Arch. Again, you can quickly make deb packages without following any of our docs and no, package manager should not solve what differs from our official build quality and Debian Policy (it would be too much hassle to predict and implement in how many ways people can break their system).

I am glad that Arch exists, so everyone has a freedom to choose it if they want :)

There is a big difference in quality of packages. Debian primary focus is stability, security, upgrading from 5 years old package to newest, strict freedom.

You can build Debian packages as Arch but that wouldn't be the Debian way.

Stability - our QA process is huge and much more strict then the Arch one. We often notice upstream bugs during our packaging and testing process and we also often patch them before upstream.

Security - we have Debian Security Team which is ruthless and security is a big focus so when for example the Chromium security problems was found, it was also noticed that that feature was disabled in Debian chromium package by default.

Upgrading - I don't think any distro can offer this without issues and those issues are exactly prevented with out packaging guides and Debian Policy. In Arch you would get from time to time - please do this manual things in order to upgrade to next version of this software. While in Debian you can go to trip to Mars, live there for few years, come back and then just apt update && apt dist-upgrade the thing and go on coffee without worry.

Also notice we had much before Arch the gpg signing of packages, you can't become Debian maintainer without at least two Debian Developer signatures on your key which happen in face-to-face meetings (so we create a web of trust you will not introduce bad code in your packaging).

So yes, you are correct that easier is to create Arch package then Debian official one, but in Debian you can also create very quickly packages (checkinstall, fpm etc etc) but then you miss all the power of Debian and you're on your own with those packages and potential breakage with system (or is that a freedom you have?) :)