toastal

ATS2 would give you all the FP + linear types + a proof system. No “capabilities” tho.

For starts looking at their website, it looks like all collaboration is locked behind proprietary platforms… Discord, Twitter, LinkedIn, Microsoft GitHub.

I can’t believe Forgejo ever thought it was a good idea to try & copy this nonsense. Rather than trying to be some FOSS MS GitHub clone, why not pitch that they can do things better—such as not having YAML spaghetti for CI.

I hope Actions stays bad tho. We need more folks to get off proprietary code forges for their open source projects—& a better CI + a better review model (PRs are awful) are 2 very low-hanging fruit that would entice folks off of the platform not for the philosophical reasons such as not supporting US corporations or endangering contributor privacy by making them agree to Microsoft’s ToS, but for technical superiority on the platform itself.

So we convert from rich formats with metadata & advanced features to a format without the former & severely lacking at the latter.

Wouldn’t you just change your economic system if you need to change the core for its fundamental flaws playing out as expected?

Would be real nice being the open source option to not have their communications locked to proprietary services (Discord, Microsoft GitHub’s forge + discussions) & had alternatives mirrored/bridged.

Very cool! +1 for hosting on Codeberg so we don’t have corporate lock-in.

Learning some more ATS2 while 3 isn’t yet released. Cool language with linear types (which go further than Rust’s affine types), refinement types, dependent types, proofs & dataviewtypes over C for zero-cost abstractions.

Code forge isn’t a weird phase & existed before Git. It is the precise term for a collaborative software, often web-based, for hosting a source code repository & perhaps bug tracker, review, & so on, but it doesn’t specify the provider’s or the type of version control system used. The prior popular alternative was mailing lists. It is the “forge” in the name SourceForge.

You are missing what a mirror is—you can use both simultaneously. This increases accessibility to those blocked under nation-state blocks or US sanctions, but also for those that value their freedom/privacy as well as those that require a lighter experience without a heavy JavaScript web application. You also won’t get to hear from this crowd that wishes for accessibility if stuck in the proprietary echo chamber. In the future, some of these forges will support ForgeFed which won’t require specific accounts with a system. Forgejo in particular follows Microsoft’s product to a fault in my opinion, but it means those that can’t pick up new skills will feel precisely at home. Sticking to hegemony doesn’t mean it is good or aligning with the changes in the world you would like to see.

> Choosing proprietary tools and services for your free software project ultimately sends a message to downstream developers and users of your project that freedom of all users—developers included—is not a priority.

— Matt Lee, https://www.linuxjournal.com/content/opinion-github-vs-gitla...

You also might want to try out some of the forge alternatives—especially those that aren’t Git—since it seems you’ve conservatively only tried one one platform. How do you know about the others & what advantages or disadvantages they bring?

Codeberg, Notabug, GitLab, SourceHut are probably the most popular options that are not self-hosted for Git (not that self-hosting is bad). Some of these can even be configured to automatically mirror to give those that care about their privacy or blocked by US sanctions the opportunity to contribute.

If you believe in free software services enough to build & release a product under this philosophy, why is a proprietary code forge service being used as a slap in the face of the free software philosophy? Is providing a non-corporate-held, non-proprietary a mirror in the TODO column?

Darcs documentation suggests amending & fixing up WIP commits too

Normally creating a new feature involves independent actions like updating dependency, refactoring some module beforehand, & so on. If these things can be broken up in a way that make review & reading logs easier, why would you squash the whole history—especially if that history is already good. In as much as it would be ridiculous to go to the other extreme of committing ever character/line as a separate commit, just collapsing the whole history isn’t a good approach. There isn’t a hardened rule about where the line is but that is okay & up to developer discretion on how they want to ‘tell the story’ to a reviewer (or their future self) about how certain chunks should be read together.

If only they would give us JXL on Android

And yet all of these serve a different, useful purpose for semantics.

I’ve in recent years started to favor reStructuredText over AsciiDoc for three reasons. 1) Docutils’s output in like 95% good, semantic HTML where Asciidoctor has a lot of issues (I would note that non-Docutils is often bad, second-class & reliant on what Markdown outputs for ‘compatibility’ (meaning less features for you)) 2) the features difference between the two I prefer the rST set (such as abbreviations) 3) the spec seems so complicated Pandoc can’t realistically have a reader, just a writer & pretty much the Ruby-based Asciidoctor application ends up being the AsciiDoc specification.

That said, I would choose AsciiDoc every single day without hesitation over Markdown the minute you are talking about documentation or any sort of technical writing since Markdown is far too feature poor & buying into one specific fork is locking you into incompatibility & other headaches/compromises.

Are they all based on Java?

> I wish Yubico had some serious competition, but sadly they don't

Also mentioning OnlyKey <https://onlykey.io>. You don’t need to be some big corpo to be considered ‘serious’.

Always kudos towards taking a self-hosted-forge approach

Just a reminder: there are alternative search engines, & most of those don’t work without JavaScript & should still be a target

Same as using GMail without PGP. GMail users are selling out the the rest of our data to Google by having one side of that conversation. It’s the same reason I am generally against using a gateway between Discord & IRC/XMPP/Matrix.

> less drastic than switching to something like Dvorak

Still no regrets. With software being such an important thing to my life, easy snake_case & kebab-case a big reason I haven’t been interested in switching to another layout.

The value add is the whole OS, top-to-bottom is now an expression of its declarative config which the others have you mutate files for config that inevitably go stale.

Having used it for a couple years now, it’s hard to express how much more comfortable I am hacking on parts of my system I don’t even understand that well since rollbacks are trivial & patches can be declarative so I can run those upstream fixes or patch things I don’t like without worry. On other distros, had I bothered to compile something for a patch rather than just waiting (or hoping) for it, it wasn’t easy to maintain new updates to that package while maintaining those patches & it was a real hassle to manually compile it. Versus Nixpkgs where I update & if there is a new package version it automatically gets recompiled according to the patches I have declared in my system’s config.

These same principles apply to development as well. Once you get the hang of it, you can customize any environment just like your system. It feels weird to value Nix in a development environment & not see it as useful for your system. …It also helps that Nixpkgs has more packages than even the AUR (that said, AUR being self-hosted is great instead of relying on Microsoft which throttles me all the time).

I feel bad for us in the Meta Lang Gang.

Marketing & social media pervade everything now

If you are doing development, something like NixOS or Guix will pay dividends. They have a higher learning curve but you can apply those stateless builds to your work as well as the rollback potential for when stuff doesn’t work. You can declare your config once & deploy it on any machine & will sometimes even be warned about config changes that have broke things like PAM for me on other machines. They aren’t generally recommended for beginners since you will need to code to use them, but you have already stated that you can.

v3 has a lot of features folks don’t talk about. But XMPP MUCs are still kicking too.

Another project locking its communications to the Discord black hole.

Microsoft GitHub is fully proprietary & while Microsoft may or may not be pulling some strings, Git is independent. OP is asking if the free & paid software have the same owner.

For small projects, there are community & non-profit options that don’t require self-hosting. Alternatively, if your tooling is actually decentralized, then you don’t need to become a massive host & a bedroom PC can ‘host’ a project.