413 karma · joined December 10, 2012
If you look at the early cohorts of DBC, anyone of those people could have learned to program on their own or already was. I think a lot of smart risk takers saw a huge opportunity that was wide open and ran with it.
I think that's really funny about the first ~3 DBC cohorts. A few grads of those first cohorts went on to start App Academy, Hack Reactor, and Hackbright Academy (I think) and others like it.
To second another comment, I am also working on scraping but for articles. In this particular example I am trying to figure out how to get the scraper to start on the first headline all the way down to the bottom, and not touch anything else. Any tips for how to get it to find the first heading on a page?
For newsletters, I really enjoy Ruby Weekly and Javascript Weekly by Peter Cooper. There is always something new to read in Ruby Weekly. I also really like the MIT Technology Review. It's a daily email that is really well written with a bunch of insightful links.
Youtube channels is a hodgepodge of whatever I am currently into. In a similar vein, I am a big fan of GoRails.
For strict information gathering, I recently got an Audible subscription and love it. I listen to music while working, but Audible I save for while I'm commuting.
Looking at ones i frequent, I have noticed a pattern to pay for services I use. I am also a privacy badger/uBlock user, but I still prefer to pay for services if it means no ads or a better experience.
In terms of the age thing, I get it. At 19 I hated being at school because I wanted to be making $20+/hour working on websites. But now at 25 and right under 6-figures, I see that I can simply work during the day and then go to school at night. It just means I have to do that for 4+ years. I started at 24, but I will not be done until I am 30. So, if I would have done it right the first time, and not dropped out, I __might__ have been further.
I don't regret it tho. I rolled the dice and although I was trying to hit the start-up lottery at that age (why I got into programming), I ended up on a great career with incredibly valuable experiences that I would not have had if I didn't drop out at 19.
8/10 would do again.
The only thing that sucks about it is all the GE classes I have to take before I can even start my fun Comp-Sci classes.
What has your experience using this file been like?
I'd also extend my admiration for the core rails team as well. A decade plus strong, and they still make beautiful software.
2. I plan ahead, but a lot of times I'll just make what I'm craving to eat.
3. Being in LA with great weather, and being a fan of southwest inspired foods, I like using the grill as much as possible. Steaks, chicken, fish, pork, burgers etc.
4. Not really. Everything in moderation, even moderation itself ;)
5. Depends on your working style. I like to generally make everything at once when I feel like doing it. But I also like making sauces, rubs, marinades, etc and I like making those ahead of time to use when I want them. The best resource for good recipes is definitely foodnetwork.com
There are still are many people (like some who have given answers in this thread) who have never been to a bootcamp, know nothing about them, and continue to shit on them just because it is a different way of doing things. On the other hand, I have heard of some bootcamps basically just doing things you could do online, so YMMV. I dropped out of college and enrolled, and I am currently writing code for a living, so these programs definitely produce value despite what ignorant people may say.
The bootcamp I personally take incredibly seriously is Hack Reactor. I applied and had a great interview, but they told me to reapply again because my js wasn't were it needed to be for their bootcamp (which is fair, as I have focused way more energy on ruby/rails). I took that as a challenge, and I will be having my second interview in the next month, and I hope to go spring of 2015.
Hack Reactor seriously produces top notch people, rivaling that of many CS degree programs in my opinion. The instructors are incredible, the founders are very empathetic who have been in the position of many people coming to the program, and the students are all top notch. I could not think of any better way to spend 12-24 weeks.
I love that line. That is so incredibly inspiring. You really are living the dream.
Your points for why tech works as a viable path are hard to reproduce in other fields, however that doesn't mean it's impossible. That needs to change, and I think companies likes Udacity which not only provide courses, but also support, will lead the way in this paradigm shift.
At the community college I attended, it was a feeder school for many Orange County students. There was a general feeling of "High School Part 2" and an incredibly laid back climate. There also happened to be over 26k students, and classes were constantly too full. After having to schedule an appointment 3 weeks in advance with a counselor to discuss my options of getting into some B level school, I was told it would take me 6 semesters, or 3 years. I decided to learn to code.
I dropped out, hit the library, and started learning. Then, I applied to, and got accepted, into Dev Bootcamp. However, my mom ended up getting diagnosed with breast cancer, and in an effort to stay closer to her, I ended up getting accepted into General Assembly's Web Devlopment Immersive in Santa Monica. I decided to take a path of books, library study time, and self guided learning utilizing the many resources available to me such as; weekly coding sessions with Keith from DBC, Stack Overflow, and Google.
"The “beginning of the unbundling of the American university” is how one observer has described the transformation. All it will take for students to avail themselves of this emerging opportunity is a clear sense of where they’re headed, lots of self-motivation, and good access to information about what mix of skills is likely to lead to a promising career."
This above statement could not be more correct. Although the tools are out there for you to learn and become whatever it is you want to do, there is almost too much information. You need someone to guide you through the obstacles on your own individual path.
One thing I do hope we see more of, is a push for continued learning and education. It appears the vast majority of people entering and graduating from our 4 year Univerisites, view college as an end all to education. There needs to be a bigger push for learning in general. I suppose this is easier said than done, however.
Totally agree. DHH actually gave a talk about this subject at Start-Up School back in 2008. Definitely worth watching http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CDXJ6bMkMY
I dont think you are lazy; I think you are afraid to fail.
Thus far in your life, you've had it easy. SAT's, Valedictorian, probably started programming when you were 12. You have seen your peers struggle to no end with this stuff, yet you've always been able to skate by, and still be better than most. At 21, to be making 130k a year is god damn impressive, not so much for the "money", but for what the money represents; knowledge and your skill level of your chosen craft.
The problem is, again from my perspective observing from the outside, you don't start something because you are afraid you are going to fail. You are afraid, that for once in your life where things have always just come naturally to you, that you will try something new and just fail miserably at it.
I don't think this is a matter of laziness; I think that you just think it is laziness, so you casually write it off as such without really examining the root of your problem.
I could be wrong, but I have seen this before. My sister sounds a lot like you; the oldest child (already the family favorite from that fact alone), perfect grades her whole life, captain of the cheerleading team (I shit you not), Valedictorian, great SAT's, accepted into some art school. She is very smart, makes 40k a year as a copywriter for some mucky-muck agency in LA. She talked to my mom about starting her own (my mom's suggestion) and her response was (surprise, surprise!) she doesn't want to be a failure because she knows most businesses fail.
Then, on the other hand, you have me. I am the only boy in my family (3 sisters), ADD, suffered from bad grades while being surround by 3 straight-A sisters, arrested at 17 for making a drug deal (long story), in some ways, the "black sheep" of my family.
I started an eBay business in high school, which made some money. Started a business in college selling hempseed oil skin care products, flipped inventory, invested the money into a side project/start up. Outsourced the development. Got interest from Nordstrom's, Whole Foods, Landry's, and Black Angus Corporate (I think a PE firm owns them) etc. Realized I loved this so much, told them I had to put it on hold, dropped out of school, and enrolled in General Assembly WDI in Santa Monica (was accepted into Dev Bootcamp, my mom got cancer, stayed closer to home, long story) and will resume operations once I can build the site from scratch myself. It's a B2B site .
What I am trying to say, is don't be like my sister. Your "perfectionist complex" seems to be the problem. I have failed, been called every name under the sun from my own family, and everything else in between, yet I keep going.
Failing is not that big of a deal; in our industry it is a badge of honor if done correctly. Don't be that guy, who in 20 years, regrets the things he has not done, instead of the things you have done.
My advice for this; fail. Fail hard. Go out and pop your "success cherry", and get the fuck out of your comfort zone. Stay humble, stay hungry, keep hacking and go change the fucking world man. Stop feeling sorry for yourself and just go do it. I mean really....what do you have to lose?
I totally agree you DO NOT need to go to these programs. Everything that they teach is definitely out there for you to learn on your own. I started to get interested in this stuff last year working on a start-up/project and I like these schools for a couple reasons;
1. I get access to instructors. Because I am a "noob" I get flustered when I spend 2-3 hours looking for an answer. 65% of the time, Stackoverflow has the answer. But for the other 35% that needs an in depth examination, having an instructor 10 feet away from me for 9 hours a day is incredible.
2. Employer confidence. I believe the best way to get fucking good at this "craft/trade" if you will, is to be gainfully employed where you get paid to spend in excess of 40 hours a week working on your craft. There is no doubt you can get a job without these programs by teaching yourself, building some shit, making a nice github and applying for entry level/intern level dev jobs. But employers like seeing you came from these programs. It's a "stamp of approval" if you will. Companies take a chance on hiring junior devs, and these programs offer some piece of mind being "hey, this person was good enough to get in this program, and has spent 12 weeks being trained by these other qualified people".
3. Network. I have had the absolute pleasure of meeting 20 other incredibly smart, driven, talented, and fun people. I get to be surrounded, pushed, and inspired by these people everyday 5 days a week, 9-12 hours a day, for 12 weeks.
4. Teaching you how to learn. This is huge for me. People on the outside seem to say that these programs make people "one trick ponies" who only know how to do some rails CRUD app. But that is really not true. The biggest thing with this program (and others) is it teaches you how to learn this stuff. Rails will be gone in a couple years replaced by something new. All this shit is always changing; it's our job as web devs to stay on top of it, and adapt to survive. Skills like asking the right questions, reading documentation, where to go when you're stuck etc.
These are just some of the benefits I can think of off the top of my head. These are not for everyone, but it has helped me immensely and love doing this. It should also be noted, I am 21 and dropped out of school to go to this.
Edit; The title changed. Originally this comment was to note on the original title of "whether app academy/DBC/HR/Hacker School etc is worth it". My argument was for why I think, in my opinion, these programs are worth it. Didn't want this taken out of context.
I am assuming he spent many days/weeks/months etc working on this site and idea, and for you to come along and shit on it is not cool.
Stick to the old adage; if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.
I applied to App Academy first. Because I dropped out of school, the no tuition appealed greatly. Ned and Kush are awesome. I was "accepted" pending the prep work and final interview. I was a total noob, and still had a PC so setting up an environment was hard. I didn't pass the final interview, but Ned was incredibly encouraging and said I could apply again.
I applied to DBC at the same time as AA and was accepted as well. I have the best parents in the world, and they bought me a refurbished MacBook Pro which helped immensely. I spent a couple months going to my local library every day for 4+ hours and made great progress. I went up to the Bay and saw the class room. I had regular "office hours" with Keith and Karim who are awesome and incredibly patient.
Unfortunately my mother was diagnosed with stage 3 breast cancer. I live in Orange County, and the 8 hour difference from here to San Fran played a role in hesitation. DBC also said I needed to simply wait another month or 2 (I was supposed to go in May) but because of the cancer, I decided to stay.
Around that time (late April) I applied to somewhere closer, and was accepted into General Assembly Web Development Immersive in Santa Monica. Because I had already been doing prep work, I completed it quickly and started class June 17. I am currently starting my 5th week of a 12 week course tomorrow.
So far we have been going really fast. The first segment was the class doing a résumé generator project in bootstrap, JavaScript, and a ruby backend also using MongoDB. We then paired off, and in groups of 2 the whole class is building any project we want, but it will be done in 3 weeks. Then with the remaining time left, we will build 2 more project each lasting 3 weeks (3 projects).
What I like most about General Assembly is after the program they have an Apprenticeship Program where you work for a local tech company (a partner company) for 3 months, 4 days a week. Every Friday you come back into GA and talk about what you did during the week, and then they offer more workshops to hone your skills further. I am working my ass off to make sure I am one of the students who gets accepted into the Apprenticeship Program.
I like the apprenticeship because of the subtle transition from student into junior dev. I like being close to my mom as well. The partner companies seem really cool, although GA hasn't told us that much about it, because they want us to remain focused.
If I can get into the Apprenticeship Program, I will obviously do that. I still want to get up to the bay as well. I applied to Catalyst (now Hack Reactor) in January because I like JavaScript, and am considering going to either DBC, AA or HR after this program, but that might be unnecessary and would put me in another 10-15k in debt on top of the 12k I am already in from GA.
Overall, these are great schools. Having had some experience with 4 of them, they are all awesome and have great teachers with great experience. From being a strictly bis-dev guy who is actually able to hold his own in the class...if I can do it anyone can as long as you realize it will be VERY hard and you have to make sure this is what you want to do.
If you have any other questions, my email is on my profile.
However, I have a real problem with this statement on the last paragraph;
"Take each of these three boys and consider what he might do when he’s older, say, at college, drunk at a party, mad at an ex-girlfriend who rebuffs him and uses words that she expects will be meaningful and respecte, “No, I don’t want to. Stop. Leave.”
Really?
That's not fair. Just because he is a little boy who likes knocking down some girls castle, why is he all the sudden destined to be a rapist come the time he is in college? The thing that gets me the most is it is totally OK for a woman to say that about a guys.
This gem too; "The “overarching attitudinal characteristic” of abusive men is entitlement."
I have no problem against feminism (I assume she is), but my only gripe about it, is it does not promote woman as equals; feminism inevitably turns into "man bashing". If men were to say the same thing, but reversed, we would be labeled as "sexist" or a "misogynist". Women, on the other hand, are applauded as "independent" or "free thinkers".
Sigh.
I, personally, wouldn't go as far as "dying", but if it works for you to channel your energy like that than more power to you. And remember, you will accomplish your goals, so once you are rich your golden years (60+) become the best because your rich as fuck and you can do whatever you want.
If you ever need someone to talk to, my email is on my profile. Keep your head up. Stay strong.
Ok, good start. Savings are very important to have. But, don't forget, 1.5 million is A LOT of money. Even if you were saving 100k a year, you would have to do that for 15 years! And remember, that's just saving money.
"I probably would have about 2.5 million if I didn't try to live like a badass for a while."
By badass, I am thinking you mean living excessively? That is not only harmful on your pocketbook, but also on your mental health. It is a very superficial lifestyle. I am assuming you may mean alcohol, drugs(?), women, stupid parties etc. It's good you realized it is unwise to live like that.
"I've always thought I would be rich and have over 100 million dollars. I see now that it is going to be impossible. I saw pg's post, and it made me suicidal"
Well, your life is not over. Nothing in this world is impossible. Just because you read PG's post, doesn't mean anything. As cheesy as it sounds, when the going gets tough, the tough get going. If you really do want that much money, wealth, and power, it does not come easy. You have to work for it.
"All the brightest minds in the world (of which I am not) with all the help in the world (which I don't have) who actually went to school for this stuff (which I did not), are STILL not able to make things work, except for a select few. 8 companies out of 547?"
The best example I have of this, happens to be this article; http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/06/how-i-started-zerocater/ it was on the front page a while back
And as for the last part of your post; don't give up. Nothing in this world worth having is easy. Don't think that successful people were handed their successes on silver platters while they were puffing their cigars wrapped in hundred dollar bills. Sure, there are exceptions, but pretty much everyone else who is successful and has "fuck you money" had to work their ass off to get it.
It is your job, as an entrepreneur, to make it happen. Successful people to have to fail way more than normal people to get to where they want to go. I am not trying to kick you while you are down but the way I see it, is you have two choices; realize that you don't have what it takes to accomplish your goals and dreams, give up, and do something else. Or, see that although your goals are lofty, they are NOT impossible. It will take time, effort, blood, sweat, tears, a lot of sleepless nights, and a little bit of luck to get there. But that's just the thing; you just might end up accomplishing those goals.
Hang in there. Go for a walk. Call some friends and catch a movie or grab a beer. Stay humble, stay hungry, and get back to work. You can do it.