Normille

  >You'd anyway likely need an app like WhatsApp or Telegram to keep track of everybody and everything - and those technically ARE considered social media right?...

Are they? I don't consider WhatsApp, Telegram and the like as social media. I don't know if there's a definitive definition for what is or isn't social media. But my own definition is that social media is a medium where you have your discussions in public. So Twitter, Facebook, Discord.. etc. [And, by that definition, I suppose a lot of forums and even HN discussions would be social media].

WhatsApp, Telegram, etc. I'd class more as private communications, alongside email and written letters.

  >I don't think absolutely 0 social media is feasible or even wise this day in age. How are you going to keep up with family, friends, and so on?...

I use Telegram for that. I have managed to persuade everyone in my family to join Telegram and a lot of my friends are on it too. I've set up a Family Channel which includes siblings, in-laws etc. where we can all share the latest goings on within the extended family and swap photos etc. All the social interaction we need, with a geographically scattered family, to all keep in touch. But without the [to me, anyway] incomprehensible need that so many other people seem to feel to broadcast our private family and circle of friends business to the entire world.

On the rare occaasions I've looked at social media content --especially Twitter or Facebook, I'm gobsmacked by the way conversations between people reveal so much personal info about themselves. It's like a huge number of social media users have some kind of mental block whereby they think if they @friend some really personal stuff, only @friend will see it. When the reality is @friend, @enemy, @employer, @parents, @spouse, @anyone-who-happens-to-be-passing-by... etc. are now privvy to that personal info.

I wonder how many of these people are also concerned about buying a Chinese phone, in case it 'spies' on them. When they're broadcasting practically their entire personal life, for all the world to see.

  >By all means, continue to read Slashdot, Hackernews, but pay attention to world news...

I guess you missed the bit where I counted how many times the Musk/Twitter story had featured on BBC News and The Guardian?

You could have a point there.

I think Musk is a bit of a dickwad. But a part of me has a grudging admiration for him. I think he epitomises the 'bit of a dickwad' inside all of us that [probably fortunately] most of us never get to indulge.

Who wouldn't want to have the wealth to fire cars into space, dig huge underground tunnels under cities and wreak our revenge on massive faceless companies that piss us off, by buying them and then sacking everyone?

I've got a nasty feeling I might engage in similar dickwaddery, if I had that kind of money.

I posted this elsewhere but worth mentioning again:

If you use Telegram, you can use the Zlib bot to search for and get books sent to you over Telegram:

https://t.me/firstlibrarybot

[Max size <50MB]

Also, the website is still available on Tor:

http://bookszlibb74ugqojhzhg2a63w5i2atv5bqarulgczawnbmsb6s6q... (books)

http://articles24t2d47kb6rbabobokvrnymh2smkleosntcu6qxou6sxe... (articles)

I find browsing for what I want on the Tor site, then using the Telegram bot to download it works best, as the site is better for browsing, but download speeds via Tor are pretty slow. Telegram downloads seem as fast [if not faster] as they were on the old website

  >Gab isn't an instance of Mastodon. 

It was in the past. Hence why I said [using past tense]...

  >Anyone remember when Gab had the biggest Mastodon instance by far...

As far as I remember the details, Gab forked Mastodon, after being effectively frozen out of the fediverse by all the other instances and indexes.

BTW --My politics are polar opposite to Gab's. But if you really believe in free speech, you shouldn't just defend it for people you agree with.

This is a bit vague, as I can't remember which site it was. I think either eBay or PayPal. But...

a while back I visited one of those 'send a 2FA code to you via SMS' websites and, not noticing the SMS bit, I entered a 2FA code from my phone's authenticator app as the number I'd been sent by SMS --which worked to let me in.

When the actual SMS 2FA code arrived on my phone a few mins later [crap phone signal here] I noticed it was the same code. So it seems like at least one site is just forwarding you the same code your authenticator app would generate, as an SMS. I'm not sure of the security implications of that --if any.

I've also noticed that, quite often when I check verious bank and credit card accounts, one after the other, the 'please enter the Xth, Xth, Xth and Xth numbers from your security code' prompt is asking for the same numbers, on each bank's site. Which strongly suggests a load of separate banks are using the same centralised security prompt generation --which sounds like a bad case of 'single point of failure' to me.

  >In the same way, forcing any website to list Gab would not be free speech...

I think you're being a bit disingenuous talking about "forcing" sites to list Gab. If individual instances wanted to de-link from it that was their perogative. But I was talking abuot sites which claim to provide indexes of what Mastodon servers are out there --ignoring the biggest one by a considerable margin, because they didn't like the politics of the people who used it.

I think if ypu're claiming to provide an index, it kind of behoves you to index everything you're supposed to be indexing. Not leave huge sections out because you don't like them. Imagine publishing a business directory where you didn't list the Jewish or black owned businesses... or printing a dictionary but leaving out all the words that began with a letter you didn't like.

Yes. No-one who believes in free speech should be "forcing" you to make good those omissions. But they're prefectly entitled to question the value of your 'publication' if you don't.

  >it's generally seen as an imposition on people's time to ask a question that could be readily answered by clicking through to the site in question and having a look

That's not going to help anyone know if there are other Mastodon servers out there, which aren't on the list. Unless that person is already aware of the existence of said server in the first place.

Anyone remember when Gab had the biggest Mastodon instance by far, by user numbers, but all the Mastodon indexes were pretending it didn't even exist? The myth of the Fediverse as some libertarian promised land free from censorship and heavy handed control is just farcical.

And, to continue the email analogy [in response to all the "Just change servers if you don't like the one you signed up for"]

If you don't like your email provider, just change to a different one...

Oh yeah. And you'll lose all your previous emails. But we won't mention that.

If you use Telegram, you can use the Zlib bot to search for and get books sent to you over Telegram:

https://t.me/firstlibrarybot

[Max size <50MB]

  >Priced at under 200 euro...

For a bit of flower-pot with a tealight inside. The phrase "more money than sense" springs to mind.

You're not alone. A lot of native English speakers get it wrong too. And the other way round as well...

"Will you borrow me ten quid?"

"No. But I'll lend you it"

The thing that surprises me most about these stories is that Twitter had 7000 employees.

Anyone who's ever tried to get hold of a human being at one of these online behemoths and been given the runaround with 'un-monitored' email addresses, contact forms which submit into black holes and copy/paste 'support' staff, would have been forgiven for thinking the whole thing was run by a couple of dozen people, at most.

What the hell did 7000 of them find to do?

Mind you, looking at some of those job titles 'Head of Inclusion, Diversity...' etc. I suspect quite a few of them are just pissed off that the gravy train has finally run into the buffers.

  >I regularly lend e-books from my city's public library...

No. You 'borrow'. The library 'lends'

Never seen that concept before. I've done similar in the past using aliases in my ~/.zshrc

  alias taskname='echo "blah. blah... instructions for task..."'

Of course, then I have to remember what nemonnic I used for 'taskname'!

Another happy long-term Duplicacy user here. My only problem with it is; on the rare occasions I need to restore something from backup, I can never remember the correct syntax and always have to look it up again.

I really didn't come here to have a go at you, as you seem to think. But as you keep responding in a fairly combative way, I feel compelled to return the favour:

  >You were complaining the other day that there was no explore page, so I make one and you’re still complaining - to me it looks like you just want to complain...

I was 'complaining' the other day because [obviously trying to cash in on the publicity surrounding Elon Musk's takeover of Twitter] you were promoting vers.social as the greatest thing since sliced bread.I had a look at the site and, apart from a 'mission statement' making the same kind of promises, there was nothing at all to see on the site, without creating an account.

For context, I should point out that I saw at least 3 or 4 other social networks I'd never heard of, blowing their own trupmets on here on the day the news was full of the Twitter takeover. It seemed everyone was trying to ride in on the bandwaggon.

So I looked on HN, as I'd a vague feeling vers.social had been discussed before and, sure enough, found a post dating back over a year, where several people had made the same point. ie. why would anyone sign up for a social network site they'd never heard of, without being able to see anything of what's inside? Your response then was combative and dismissive:

  >Okay then don’t sign up. I’m personally tired of hearing this...

You were equally dismissive when I made the same point in this current thread. Responding:

  >Unfortunately just because a couple people on Hacker News requested a different homepage it doesn’t change how the market works. 

But, to your credit, you did eventually allow us a peep inside.

However, when I revisited the site to take another look, all I saw were a very few posts, spread out over quite a long time and all by the same 3 or 4 people. So, a bit tongue-in-cheek, I responded with a "I can see why you didn't want us to see inside..." quip. Which you've also got really defensive about [See quote with which I began this reply]

I don't know if it's a generational thing, or a 'brash American' cultural thing but what I find really tedious is this current 'Silicon Valley startup' philosophy of over-promising and under-delivering, combined with a wannabe Steve Jobs / Linus Torvalds "You're holding it wrong, you fucking idiot!" attitude from the founder/s.

If, knowing the demographic of this place, you come on a site like HN to promote your latest thing and you get some feedback, then take it on board and consider that many of the people on here have 'been there, done that, got the T-shirt' The fact that the first time you posted about vers.social on here you got 23 comments with good feedback and ignored it all. And then the second time time you posted about it you got no response at all, should have told you something.

And it's not just that you're ignoring the feedback. It's the fact that you're batting it away in a fairly aggressive manner. Again, what were you expecting from HN? This is a tech savvy site with a lot of members who've founded or worked in big, successful companies. They're going to give you feedback which you may not like, but which will be useful and constructive. If you just want people to blow smoke up your arse and tell you how 'arse-sum' whatever you've created is, there are sites like Facebook and Instagram for that.

Anyway. This is going nowhere. So, Normille -over and out.

Bang! --Ouch, my foot!

  >...praying it lands in Siberia and not NYC. 

or vice versa.

  >Personally I run into interesting things all the time, and it seems great to be able to have a place to store them so I don’t forget about them. 

>I use several different kinds of apps for that already. Google, Pocket, a note-taking app, a list app. Heck, Anki fits the description as well.

I've found an unexpected use case here for Telegram. I have Telegram open all the time in the background on all my computers and mobile devices. It has a 'Saved Messages' feature, which shows up in your contacts list like another conversation. Whenever I come across 'stuff' [or is 'shit' the cool word?] I want to remember it's really easy to just copy a link... or image/video URL... or some text I'm interested in... or scribble down an idea I've had and send/share it to 'Saved Messages' in Telegram.

Then, when I've got time to catch up and digest. I just open the 'Saved Messages' conversation in Telegram and there's all my stuff... er... 'shit' including; web previews, photos, embedded videos, etc. And it's there, instantly synced across all my devices. I also find myself using this as a really quick method of sending files between mobile devices and desktop/laptops. For me Telegram syncs instantly and 100% reliably --which is more than I've ever found Google Drive and its ilk to be capable of.

Seems to me that; if US car companies are giving up on the idea [Didn't Tesla recently announce similar?] then the idea is pretty much dead for now. I could just about see self-driving vehicles working in US cities with their straight roads and grid layout. But the twisty narrow roads of most European towns and cities would add a whole extra level of complexity.

Now I can see why you were so reluctant to let us 'peep behind the curtain' before. From that 'Explore' page, it looks like you only have 4 members. One of whom posts about 90% of the content.

Bang! --Ouch. My foot!

Bang! --Ouch. My foot!

Good to see the froth-lipped Daily Fail leaping to the conclusion it was those nasty Russians. Which is odd, given we've been told for the past few months that they're so technologically backward they're stripping down washing machines to salvage chips for their weaponry.

I suspect the real culprit might be closer to home [0] --although, naturally, we'll never be allowed to know, if it is. Nor will there be any political fall out. Because being a gimp means the master is always right. Isn't that so, Germany?

[0] https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/news/world/us-spied-on-...

[0] https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/us-security-agency-spie...

I think you mean "blue collar"

  >Go to Twitter logged out, what do you see? How about Facebook?

With respect to the dev; most people have a pretty good idea what Facebook and Twitter are about and some idea of the huge numbers of people using each site. It's also highly likely that we all know countless people with Facebook, Twitter, Instagram etc. accounts. So, even if there's a locked door with a "Create an Account to See What's Inside!" sign at the entrance, we've a pretty good idea what's going on inside, can be pretty sure that we'll find someone in there to interact with, and so make an informed decision as to whether to venture in.

Vers? How many people have even heard of it --never mind know anyone with an account there? So, what's the incentive for me [or anyone] to go to the hassle of setting up yet another website account, just to see what's inside? The huge incumbent social media websites don't need to try and draw people in. New upstarts do. And I think it takes a bit more enticement than "We're not going to tell you what's in here. But buy a ticket anyway. It'll be great!"

It really doesn't matter a fig to me and [I presume] the millions of other people who have no interest in using Twitter or any other social media. Of course, if you're part of one of the echo chambers that does, it's probably really newsworthy stuff.

People join social networks to socialise --there's a clue in the name. If said network respects their privacy, doesn't shove ads in their face and doesn't annoy them, those are all welcome additional bonus points. But the primary reason is to interact with other people.

I think you're pretty misguided if you think many people will flock to a social network that [with respect] is almost unheard of, when they; can't even see how many other people are using it / read what kind of topics are being discussed there / gauge what the 'tone' of the place is / see whether anyone they know is already there.

You're doing the equivalent of asking people to pay to get into a nightclub, without letting them know what kind of people go there, what kind of music they play, or even whether there's anyone else inside.

It's not bandwaggon jumping to point this out. It's just a really obvious barrier to entry that you refuse to recognise, even though you've had it pointed out to you more than once and for over a year.

I had a feeling this had been discussed on HN a few times before. And I think it's pretty obvious why anyone with a social network to plug is trying to ride in on the Twitter/Elon publicity bandwaggon, this week.

I looked at the longest discussion [0] from just over a year ago and the first post I saw was this, from ColinWright:

----

I came here to say the same thing as square_usual[0] said elsewhere[1], but I'll expand on that a bit.

My immediate thought was ... Hmm, I wonder what this is? Is it like Twitter? Is it like Facebook? Is it like Mastodon? Is it like Instagram? TikTok? QQ? Pinterest? Reddit? Hacker News? How is it different? How is it new?

Then the first thing I saw was a paragraph of text and a sign-in form.

You are competing for people's attention, and while your platform may be wonderful, if you don't get people to try it, it will die unloved. The first thing you've done is given them a barrier, not a taster.

----

I've just revisited the site today and nothing has changed. You can't see anything of the content unless you sign up for an account. Any site that's supposed to be a 'community' that won't even let me peep behind the curtain without creating an account, I just assume it's a ghost town and they're trying to trick people into creating accounts, just to artificially inflate the user figures.

Pity you didn't take ColinWright's advice on board a year ago. I see that every subequent discussion of vers.social on here has attracted no interest whatsoever. Maybe that ahould also tell you something.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28927767