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Comment by dangrossman | Hacker News Reader

You can't work for free for a startup. Federal law requires you be put on payroll and paid at least minimum wage. No employment contract can supersede that law. Silicon Valley has to be one of the more challenging places to live without a high-paying job: the average rent for a 1-bedroom apartment around San Francisco is over $3000/month. Why don't you want to be compensated for this labor you're looking to provide to a startup?

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I appreciate the response. I plan on living in my van for the first several months until i get established. The reason i asked to work for free is that its been so hard to get a job and my background is not in the tech space i felt this would be the best way to get my foot in the door. I am hungry and willing to prove myself to a great team.

If you really want to get into the tech sector, work for free for yourself and then get a paid job. Teach yourself iOS or Android development, build an app, and then promote it yourself. The app probably won't go anywhere, but seeing an actual polished app that's actually being promoted and maybe even used by a few people looks really good to any potential employer. Then get a job at market-rate wages instead of selling yourself short.

If you value yourself at nothing, chances are your employer will value you at nothing too. They'll extract whatever free work they can out of you and say goodbye as soon as you start asking to be paid.

That's a great idea. I will def do that. Its not that I don't value myself at nothing I was just trying to get in any way I can. I worked in the music industry for 5 years (large record labels) and that's how I got my foot in the door so I was just trying to do the same. Thanks for the great advice

I also came to the tech sector having previously worked in a field where the only way to get established was by working for free (publishing in my case) and was surprised to find I couldn't do the same to get a programming job.

Tech is different, and the fastest way to get an employer to stop taking you seriously is to ask for less than you appear to be worth.

Unpaid internships exist, although I believe they often substitute class credit for actual wages.

I already graduated college, but i have thought of that aswell.

Unpaid internships can't involve the intern doing work for the benefit of the employer, which is what he's offering. Here's the six criteria test for unpaid internships from the Department of Labor:

http://www.dol.gov/whd/regs/compliance/whdfs71.pdf

Virtually all internships in tech are paid internships. Colleges that run coop programs give credits for internships in addition to the students getting paid: it's sold to them as a way to help pay their college costs while getting work experience before graduating. An employer can't pay you in college credits.

Dan thanks again for all the feedback. I truly appreciate it.

Couldn't he get around this by doing contracted work and wanting only $1 for payment?

Or just don't bill. That's not illegal.

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