Get Your Shit Together
getyourshittogether.org
getyourshittogether.org
Do your loved ones a favor - hire a lawyer to do it. It's not free, but they'll do the actual paperwork, and you'll get the comfort of knowing it's done right.
Also, you better be damn sure that you can trust the person you give power of attorney to -- the document provided here assigns power of attorney immediately, not on incapacitation/death, and allows the person you designate to gift themselves up to $13,000 a year of your own property without your consent.
Considering the laws of the 50 states are sometimes very different, and these documents cover a wide range of legal topics, I think you'd have to be an idiot to use these documents without running them by a lawyer in your state, because they might not have the consequences you think they have.
Frankly I don't see why the HN crowd would upvote a site like this -- I'd bet it was ring votes that got it to the front page. Or maybe it was just the snarky domain, who knows.
www.uslegalforms.com has been around for a long time now, and they at least have state-specific documents. Use them if you're going to use anything without consulting a lawyer. But really, pay a lawyer, it's worth it.
I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice.
I think this got upvoted because it offers a monthly email nudge/reminder and hopefully the site/service will stay on top of future issues related to staying on top of keeping your stuff together.
But yeah, talk to a lawyer to ensure state specific issues are properly covered/handled.
They're the canonical reference if you're dead or not, so upon my death, I could have configured in their web interface:
* who to notify, along with documents for each person (personal letters, etc)
* who to turn bank accounts over to
* a whole long laundry list of other stuff I have to find someone I trust to do if I do sooner than expected
What organization is typically entrusted to do this sort of task? I don't mind paying for my loved ones to be secure and guided after my death, I just want an org that I can 1) trust and 2) will be around for 100+ years.
I'm curious what their UX around it is; I should ask! Ideally, my wife would provide them proof of my death, and then they would say "Here are your options, and the consequences of each."
Of course it suck if you end up on it while you are still alive
http://consumerist.com/2015/05/04/being-declared-dead-by-the...
>She learned that she was dead when she received a letter from her bank. The bank expressed its corporate condolences, and locked her out of her account. The Social Security Administration also stopped her retirement checks, and her health insurance also stopped.
Adding a few fields to a database is well within the capabilities of pretty much every government agency around. At least until feature bloat and cruft starts to develop...
My guess is it struck a chord with people similar to myself - young family and minimal EOL planning. (although the snarky domain definitely helps)
For us, the biggest problem has been deciding who should take care of the kids if something happens to both myself and my spouse. The only members of our family that aren't shitty people or very flaky are elderly or have medical issues preventing them from caring for children. (And all of our close friends have kids and full lives of their own.) I would love to hear if anyone has suggestions for determining the least shitty choice in a situation like that.
Make sure to have life insurance, and have your lawyer set it up as a trust for the child's well-being. You can designate someone other than the caretaker of the child to be the trustee of the trust if you want to decentralize responsibility, though in our case we found that unnecessary. In our case, we recognized that additional kids would mean our designees need a bigger house, so we took a very liberal view of what constitutes the children's well-being.
Also keep in mind that you may revise your choices over time. We reasoned that her friend is the best choice for this 5 years, but when our daughter gets a bit older, we can reevaluate and see who in our then-social-circle is the ideal.
And one of our children is autistic and will likely need long-term care when she's an adult. Maybe one of our other children will step up when the time comes, but I can't count on that.
My plan is to live forever.
So yes saying no would be selfish, assuming that any of your friends would have their lives completely disrupted just because you have children seems quite a bit more selfish.
I can think of exactly two sets of people in our diverse set of friends (and they are good friends) whom we might ask for this kind of consideration, but really, even both of them are problematic for reasons that have nothing to do with the quality of our friendship.
Taking care of more children would be difficult for my wife and I but I would strongly consider it if we were approached by one of our friends or family members about it.
Our life with 5 kids is already full but we are stable, love each other and have the resources, both emotional and financial to provide for more.
We would have to change our life and make sacrifices but that's what love is all about.
This doesn't really answer your question, it's more about taking care of someone else's children than finding someone to take care of your own. But if you are thinking about these things the other side is that you need to ask yourself if you could make the sacrifice to take in more kids yourself.
My criteria for choosing who would take care of my children are simple:
1. their family is emotionally capable. 2. the family is willing - including both parents and any children they already have.
We're talking about an already incredibly bad situation. My goal wouldn't be to give my kids everything they would have if they still had their parents. It would be to minimize the risk of more horrible things happening to them - abuse, abject poverty etc.
However, we are still struggling with how to distribute the life insurance in this case. Currently, she would get it all, but I think setting aside x% for education for each kid is worth considering (maybe y% for after college graduation). I realize someone taking in someone else's kids will incur some costs, so I think they should get 'something' - with two more kids, they may need to upgrade their house.
Thoughts on %'s or amounts?
Not saying it is not useful or important. It just doesn't fit the subject matter people come here to read.
Find a loving family, they are the answer. And make sure the life insurance is sorted out.
I would expect this to be a very rare occurrence. Most likely is an accident that kills one of the parents only, but in most scenarios where both parents are together, they would have the children with them. I guess it's always important to plan for risks, even if they are rare, if the consequences are very bad - 'high threat, low probability' is the military term, I believe?
For instance, my wife and I need more videos of us and not just the kid. If something happened to me tomorrow I would love it if my wife could show him videos of me when he gets older.
I agree that maybe the site needs a disclaimer that getting a lawyer is better but for some isn't a generic form better than nothing? Not a lawyer either so not entirely sure about that.
Or maybe it's because the site is a useful checklist of what we should do to prevent death from completely destroying our family.
I'm the original poster and I'm not affiliated with the author in any way. The core message is not "we offer 100% legalese-proof papers", the pdfs are described as templates. The core message is:
Get your shit together now and breathe a huge sigh of relief.Plus, I'm not sure my family would enjoy looking through my will upon my death with: Get Your Shit Together! printed at the bottom of each page :)
This site is helpful to let me know which parts I overlooked like simple things like passwords or account access.
Who cares? I'd make "get your shit together" a condition of inheriting anything from me if it had any legal standing.
If you view this as an MVP of an open source repository for EOL information then it makes total sense that it got upvoted here. If we can keep our code dry, why can't we keep our lives dry?
When he passed away, I found out that the will is invalidated because that's how it works in Georgia's legal system. Luckily my dad's wife is a nice woman and worked with me to ensure the estate went through probate properly.
But always double check when your life's circumstances change (new residence, etc)
Even with a will, in some places the probate process is very expensive and onerous. In many cases, it's a lot easier to use a simple trust mechanism vs. a will. 3 hours of attorney time now can avoid 50 hours + lots of calendar time later.
You won't be doing a "whole lot of work", but anyway, what works really well is giving a lawyer professional paperwork from another state (or whatever) and telling him to fix it for your state's laws.
They handle this kind of "translation" all the time because of people who moved in from another state, they might be a bit confused if you moved in from the state of "the internet" but it'll be less confusing than walking in with a completely blank slate. At least they'll have to ask a lot fewer questions and explain a lot fewer things. Spending money to telling a lawyer "i donno" can be very expensive compared to how cheap it is to tell him something like "I want the inheritance to work something similar to Wisconsin law"
Think by analogy of doing desktop support for a guy who can't articulate anything clearer than "the internet is broken on the hard drive", its gonna cost him a lot. But if the guy walked in with professional documentation of his specific problem, its gonna be a lot cheaper.
If you don't, or cash strapped now, you can get by with Nolo press. If you can understand ROR, and programming, after reading their two books on wills and trusts, I think you can set up a trust and will, and skip the lawyer.
On the will get two signatures from people not in the will, and it does not need to be notarized in California. If you want to exclude a child out of a estate you must explicitly state that in the will.(Some kids got a lot of cash early on. Explain to them you love them. Make sure they are doing well, if you exclude them.) I recently did a will for a friend. Her daughter took all the family money when her father died--leaving her mother with nothing. The ironic part is her daughter is a multimillionaire in LA, with a successful business. She took advantatage of a bad situation, and a angry dying man. So yes, I didn't feel it was immoral to exclude her from the will of that friend.
If you are leaving a large asset (money, house, investments, a 500 foot yacht in the Bahamas you never told anyone about) then the person getting it should know before hand.
If you have kids you need to discuss what happens to them, who takes care of them etc. This is a careful balance of the burden you put on family and friends and the well being of you children with the balance favoring your kids.
The most important thing is that you have these discussions and then document them in a will. Do not just fill out an online form, have it notarized and filed in a safe deposit box to be unearthed when you meet your end, timely or otherwise.
The process of creating a will like this can be a catalyst to re-prioritize your life and what is important to you and your family.
But of course, it doesn't have to be. As this site mentions, get your shit together! It's better to have a boilerplate will squirreled away somewhere that no one but your lawyer knows about than none at all.
If you are leaving a large asset (money, house, investments, a 500 foot yacht in the Bahamas you never told anyone about) then the person getting it should know before hand.
Could you elaborate on why you should tell someone before hand that you're going to leave assets in their name? Is it just common courtesy/manners in your opinion? Or something else? I'm genuinely courageous.Also, family conflicts. If your brother's uncle's nephew gets the house instead of the son who expects it, but there's good reason (he was renting it already), family conflicts arise for not great reasons.
If I left my house to my brother who travels all over the place and has a carefree life it might be more of a burden trying to maintain it, rent it out or sell it than its worth. It might not, but that's why I would talk to him before putting it in a will.
Also, having these kinds of conversations is good for everyone involved because it makes them think about the little details beforehand and not while they are in the middle of funeral plans and grieving.
It's called estate planning, not estate liquidation or estate lottery. You wouldn't make major plans regarding your family without talking to your spouse or business plans without talking to your partners.
Just because you won't be around doesn't mean you should treat it any differently. Anyone involved in your estate should be involved prior to your will going into effect whether they be executors, caregivers or recipients.
Someone who's totally clueless about 500 foot yachts is just going to get screwed over either as executor or inheritor... hope at least one of them is semi-clueful about yachts, hopefully ahead of time. There are bottom feeders who look thru the legal notices in the paper and will descend on the grieving victims with absolutely ridiculous offers to take the hassle away... for pennies on the dollar, if that. Oh that classic Ferrari in perfect condition, well, I can't really offer more than scrap steel price for that, and next thing you know some poor widow gets screwed out of $100K.
If the balance "favours your kids", presumably meaning that the new caretakers feel overwhelmed by that responsibility, I guess they could refuse that responsibility. I guess having that wish be in your will might pressure them sufficiently to actually go through with that responsibility, but that kind of pressuring somehow doesn't feel right either.
And it's not just relatively young people or unexpected deaths. Many senior citizens with decent sized estates are totally unprepared or just assume their family will figure it out.
You pass on a lot of additional stress and hardship to your loved ones by not being prepared.
I love the site title btw.
The relative worked in the financial services industry and had provided me advice about estate planning.
When it came to the estate things were not prepared at all. If fact it was a bit of a mess.
I guess it's the case of builders living in unfinished houses and that.
If you are familiar with the current pending Supreme Court case DeBoer v. Snyder (which for the Supreme Court was combined with 3 other cases) you'd know in many cases you can't just appoint any guardian for your children upon your death. Basically the facts are: a lesbian couple has 4 children - 2 adopted by one woman and 2 adopted by the other. All children have been raised together as brothers and sisters by both women. No children we ever being raised by only one parent. They found out that they couldn't guarantee that the other parent would keep all 4 children in the event of the death of one parent. Under Michigan law, in their case, the courts would be free to appoint guardianship of the deceased's two children to whomever they choose no matter the paperwork the couple drafted beforehand.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/25/us/one-couples-unanticipat...
>Their close call with the truck that day in 2011 led them to a lawyer, Dana Nessel, who advised them that she could draw up guardianship papers, but that they would be nearly worthless legally. She urged them instead to file a federal lawsuit challenging the adoption law in Michigan.
On the other hand a trust can be either notarized or witnessed (EPTL §7-1.17) and a power of attorney must be notarized (General Obligations Law §5-1501B, which also requires a typeface "no less than twelve point in size").
For example:
- do you want to be buried or cremated? And where? Any thoughts on coffin design?
- do you want a church service or something else? What songs, how big, as many details as possible.
It's morbid stuff, but by writing it down informally somewhere, you lift the burden from your loved ones having to make unknown "it's what he would have wanted" guesses.
And in other news, I still owe him a trip into the Great Smoky Mountains to scatter his ashes.
She also wants her body to be burned in a viking longship out at sea. We'll see how that goes.
To each his own, but consider that maybe that's not the right question. My paternal grandmother recently died, and my dad sat shiva for her (Jewish mourning ritual). It almost certainly would not have been what she wanted, she was a fierce atheist. But it was what my dad wanted, what comforted him, and he was the one around and mourning, not my grandmother.
Just something to consider.
To be fair, if I someone made me go through coffin designs for my own coffin, or any kind of arrangement, chances are it would end in a practical joke. I just don't give a damn.
We humans have a hard time remembering that anything we communicate has _a lot_ of implicit context. On the Internet, this becomes especially conspicuous because our communications quickly escape the realm where that implicit context is known & valid. Up to now, the way to deal with that seems to be EULAs written in Legalese.
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/04/29/the-right-pa...
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/17/health/the-trouble-with-ad...
* Document -all- of your bank accounts, assets and debts.
* Don't die without a will. If you do and you appoint an executor, you are giving them a very dirty job.
* Think twice about offshore accounts. They are a nightmare for executors.
This is one of the reasons I've been putting off completing a will :-( Is there a good option for going about this without naming an executor?
You can appoint lawyers to be executors to your estate, mind you. They take a fee from the total bucket, and make sure everything is done according to your will.
Also, as far as I'm aware, appointing them the executor of your estate doesn't mean you give them the money. You entrust them with resolving all the issues with your estate, it's a bit different.
My best plan so far is to put the database on a hidden (but public) shared location, and use IfIDie.org to send the link to my inheritors. I would then physically meet with them and give them the password (but not the link). It's kind of awkward, and I don't love it, but seems like it could work even for my relatives of modest technical literacy.
I'd be really curious if anyone has a better approach for securely passing important data after you're dead.
Sometimes low tech works.
1) It's cumbersome to update. I don't want to run to the bank, get the thumbdrive, update it, and take it back every time I change a password.
2) Everyone has to know that I have the box, know where it is, and know where to get the key.
3) The key could get lost or destroyed. For example, if someone slings an especially effective curse at me and I literally die in a (house) fire. You can keep the safe deposit key in a safe... but now you have to store the key for that safe, or the combination.
4) Even if they have the key, the bank still might not let my next-of-kin into the box. The bank keeps a list of who is allowed in and their signatures. You'll have to physically take every person who needs access down to the bank and add them. It's one more chore, particularly because my family lives in other states and rarely comes here to visit (we all go back to the parents' house instead). In theory a death certificate and some other documentation can overcome that, but it's going to be time consuming and annoying, during a time when they don't need one more damn thing. I'm also not sure how access is handled in case of incapacity but not death (ie, coma, sick in a foreign country, kidnapped, whatever).
Some sort of secret sharing scheme [1] seems like it would work well here. You can distribute parts of a key so that any 3 of 5 people (or whatever) can work together to recover the key. Unfortunately I don't know of any practical way to do this without kludging together your own system.
Utility/subscription type services pretty much get a copy of the certificate and they go away, maybe with a final billing statement. Look out for scammers sending fake invoices to dead people listed in obituaries or legal notice section of the paper.
Where it gets messier is non-financial institution online accounts, but they wouldn't be financially important or time critical. I remember ebay was fairly civil about the whole thing, although I don't remember what they did.
For instance, I get relatively straightforward short-term and long-term disability insurance through my company. Should I become disabled, I get a percentage of my salary. But because my wife does not work, we've struggled to find a straightforward way to get (reasonably priced) disability insurance for her.
I'm assuming that many of you who are either self-employed or are in a household in which one person is not currently working have faced similar challenges. Anybody have any recommendations about how to overcome them?
[1] http://www.amazon.com/The-Ultimate-Financial-Plan-Balancing/...
Anytime you buy insurance you have to be ready to do some math. If you make enough to cover a caregiver (often covered or partially covered under health insurance) for your wife and have a strategy for taking care of your kids then you may not even need it.
I'm fortunate enough to live close to both my parents and my wife's parents. Because of this and because we have decent savings we decided against disability and life insurance for her. We are in the process of getting better life insurance for myself but are keeping it as low as possible to cover our debts and living expenses until the children are old enough to go to work in the coal mines.
If fact you should create an account on ssa.gov and irs.gov no matter what so nobody else does it for you if your identity is stolen.
I ended up enrolling in California's Disability Insurance Elective Coverage (DIEC) - http://www.edd.ca.gov/disability/self-employed.htm. I wonder if anyone else has gone this route?
They make it easy for you to get organized, find resources for handling the tougher scenarios of life and death.
*Not affiliated, just have met their team - all around good people.
I had a friend who committed suicide, but his body was never found and since there was no note, he was never officially declared dead. Even though that was years ago, his family still doesn't have access to his assets.
http://www.amazon.com/Quicken-WillMaker-Plus-2015-Software/d...
Nolo is a well-known established company, like LegalZoom for books, and I've also used their stuff for business setup and contracts.
We had already gotten our will done before we took it but I still found it to be packed with good information and it motivated us to get more organized.
I keep hearing this, but I don't believe it. No kids, no assets of any significance, and my state's intestacy laws are fine by me for what there is. Of course, I'll revisit when my situation changes but I just can't see why making and maintaining a will needs to be a high priority for me.
My mom was on her checking account (because my mom took care of a lot of her finances) so my mom automatically got all of her money in the world - $900. The only other thing she owned was her house. Her will said it was to be sold and the money split between her children. Exactly zero of her children were interested in the house, selling the house, living in the house, or anything to do with the house. So the house was abandoned along with all the stuff in her house. My grandma knew that would happen (the house was literally falling apart - if code enforcement saw it then it would be condemned) but she made a will because she was "supposed" to.
I've been working for years in end-of-life planning and as others have said, a lot of these legal documents are state-by-state so be sure to talk to an attorney and your healthcare providers to make sure you're covered.
Apologies for self promotion, but we are building a modern end-of-life planning platform at https://myexitstrategy.co/ and our first offering will be an easy way to designate health care proxies -- everyone over age 18 should have one!
First, it could have been an inch back in my head, and I might not be here to talk about it at all. Or I could be hospitalized for an extended time, or a vegetable, or permanently unable to work.
Second, there's about a one in six chance it will happen again. If that happens, I could lose my other eye, and my ability to read - thus ending my career. I'd also lose driving and any number of other things I enjoy.
Is my shit together? No. I just assume my assets go to my wife, and she can share out what she feels should be shared out with our now-adult children, friends, and my (distant) family.
I am going to be entering medical school. You typically get disability after you graduate, but if something happened in those four years, I could be a hundred thousand in debt with no viable career option as an MD.
Be responsible, don't cut corners.
I know someone who is a beneficiary and an executor of an estate currently nearly £10,000 in debt countering a challenge of a will (as the beneficiary, not the executor, however).
It is particularly important to review and revise these documents after life changing events: getting married, having children, or when parents or executor becomes elderly, incapacitated, or dies.
Also there is no silver bullet for the maze that is life other than all the usual methods that the old masters laid out, like meditation, compassion, empathy, and logos/love/balance
I need to get my shit together.
The thing that bothers me are the auto renew settings on my subscriptions. One (any probably only) way to stop them is to cancel the cards they are on. For e.g: Dropbox/ Amazon s3 will charge me for my hosted data for eternity.
In 2009 my husband was killed in an accident. In the following hours, weeks, and months I was shocked by the number of things we had left disorganized or ignored.
There are different tactics that can be used to try to get past the denial. Stating things bluntly is a worthwhile tactic. Merely mentioning facts is another possible tactic, but you run into the problem that people would prefer to screen out any information about such a painful topic.
This a subject where shock tactics can be justified, if they manage to get people to think about the fact that, yes, they will die someday.
This a good site, and can help to guide you. Probably even give you templates to store your info in, but what about sharing?
Check out my company www.estateassist.com (Estate Assist) which is much more focused on being a Digital Safe Deposit box to protect and share financial and digital assets with trusted recipients.There is no imaginary place in the sky where you can look down after your death and see people happy because you left them money or less stress.
Live life for the present and future. Not for the nothing.
Sure, game theory might throw a spanner in the works for the now and future-
- Your partner having a will / life insurance might be important, so you have to get one for quid quo pro.
- You might be stuck being stupid and it'll help you relax. Humans are weird.
- Stupid people might judge you or smart people might sham you (Since wills probably benefit society)
But this crutch we can get, that in death my kids and wife will be happy, a false safety valve, can be more destructive to your life than the reasons above.
Making sure that the financial needs of your loved ones are met if you do depart in a sudden manner, is the most selfless thing you can do. It has nothing to do about making you feel happy, it has everything to do with being pragmatic so that they have one less thing to worry about.
But that's hard. It means you have to be healthy. Reduce stress. Spend quality time with people.
Filling out a will is an easy escape.
Doing the best for yourself and loved ones is hard. The second half of the article touches on this.
I don't believe in life after death, but I do believe that the world will continue to exist after I die. And in that world, chances are good that my wife and kid will still be alive, but I will not be earning money to support them. Planning for that scenario is not stupid at all. It has nothing to do with how I or anyone else will feel, unless you count "hungry" as a feeling.
This is extraordinarily variable based on where you are in your life. If you have a lot of assets or a family that depends on your income, a will and life insurance can make sense. If you are like me, a single, 26 year old who has a decent job, some assets, but that's it, it's a waste of time and money.