ASK HN: Is the Bay Area the Only Good Place for Software Engineers? | Hacker News Reader

ASK HN: Is the Bay Area the Only Good Place for Software Engineers?

6 pointschrisper15 comments

I am graduating soon and am looking at possible places to live / work. I am currently in the Bay Area, but have also considered moving to Switzerland (I am allowed to work there). Many people say that the Bay Area is the Mecca for Software Engineers. To what extent is this true? If I was working in Switzerland I would miss out on something? As much as I like the US, I am a bit dissapointed about many things here (politics, cost of living, healthcare etc. etc.).

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Don't just think of the US job market for Software Engineers as the Bay Area, not that SV or the Bay Area is bad. It is just that there is a huge market opportunity outside of Cali and frankly I think the cost of living and salaries are way better in other areas. I lived/worked in Austin for awhile and that is hard to beat. But so is Florida (where I am now), and a ton of other places. NYC and Boston as examples don't necessarily beat Cali by much in the cost of living but they sure make up for it in diversity.

No matter what, no, the Bay Area is not the only place to work as a software engineer. Nor in my opinion is it even the best place to be. I will admit that it is the most popular and most publicized and so has some credibility and perks to match, but really, that is not what makes the work. I know nothing of the Switzerland market so I can't comment on that. But I can say the East coast of the US is doing well and getting better all the time, and the amount of creativity is awesome. Not to mention you have Austin, Seattle, NYC, Boston and many other places to choose from.

Good luck and don't let the SV hype get in your head, there is more to the world of Software Engineering then just Silicon Valley.

That's exactly what someone, not living in the Bay Area, would say.

I lived and worked in the bay area as a software dev for a decade. I'm now living in the midwest of all places, and I'm happier for it, doing less work for more money which lets me live my life. With the cost of living so much lower rent wise, it's a double win.

Also, screw traffic on 880/101 or dry humping your fellow rider on BART commute hour trains. I don't miss it at all.

You have actually posed two separate questions (that for me would have different answers).

QUESTION NUMBER ONE: Is the Bay area the only good place for Software Engineers?

I think most would agree there are other good cities. Seattle or Boston are great examples with large tech companies located there.

The fact that most people can't answer if Switzerland is good option is very informative in and of itself.

How many large Tech companies can you name from Switzerland?

I have been to Geneva before and didn't find a very compelling tech scene. I bet there would be some scientific companies that would be great though, but I don't know enough.

QUESTION NUMBER TWO: Would you be missing anything?

Absolutely. Whatever city is behind Silicon Valley in second place, is very far far far behind. The best and the brightest talent head straight to silicon valley. Peter Thiel made the statement that they are not opening Venture Capital offices in any other city because they didn't think there was enough value, meaning that the big ideas come to Silicon Valley - so venture capital will wait for it there.

The biggest advantage to SV is that if things don't work out at your first job, you don't need to move to get a second one. I would say the worst that happens if you take a job not in SV, is that you'll have to move for your next job.

Seattle's cost of living is a lot cheaper than SF, and there are a lot of big tech companies (Amazon, Microsoft, Google, Facebook, Salesforce).

The Bay Area is certainly a good market for software engineers. It's also probably the best place for start ups, if you're going that route.

But don't let that stop you from looking at alternatives. Especially outside of the US - it's refreshing living in a more civilized country (national health care -gasp-, and the list goes on). Switzerland is a beautiful place as well, and is one of the few successful direct democracies in the world. It would be an enlightening place to live for a while, I think.

I've worked in Chicago and London, and grew up in Cali and New York. Personally I do really like San Fran, but the rest of the bay area is a bit of a dump IMO. It's suburbs, mega mansions, and strip malls.

I don't think so. But, the 2nd best city would be in the far second place, especially if you want to be in the startup environment.

Seattle is probably second best, and I'm not sure it's fair to call it "far" second place, especially not given the poster's concerns about California which are separate from the software business environment. There are a great many software companies here both large and small, there is no risk of having to move if you want to change jobs, and there is a steady trend where SV companies establish satellite offices so they can attract some of the many Seattle-based engineers who are unwilling to move south.

You can live pretty much anywhere as a software dev/engineer these days. Our local Ruby user group in North Carolina has members with remote jobs across the country.

If you are good enough, you can get hired by a SV startup to work from a place where life is cheaper than in the Bay Area. Switzerland is not that place, definitely.

Also consider that everyone is trying to move to SV and you are trying to leave. What's wrong with you? :P

NYC is also a possibility.

A lot of companies hire remote teams now. My current employer uses an outsourcing company in Europe.

http://jobdensity.com/

SV isn't just worth the cost. Places like NYC, Boston, and if you're willing to lease a car - frankly any metro area have tech jobs. I've had many friends state their unhappiness with the valley, perception meets reality; a paris Syndrome.

As for San Francisco (SF) proper. Homeless. Expensive rent. Hard to find a decent place to live, or to park, or sit. It gets better the further you go out. Frankly, if you insist, I think that some places in Oakland and Berkeley are great.

USA is a great country, you don't need to be in NYC/LA/SF to be happy! You could end up finding a job in Florida for example that pays 75% of what you get in SV - you would be living like a king and have money to save.

In either event, please don't get roped into the trap in an expensive market (NYC / SV) and taking stock instead of pay.

I'd say working remotely for a company from the Bay Area is better :)

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