Comment by eranation | Hacker News Reader

Comment by eranation | Hacker News Reader

My tips.

1. never criticize your boss, your company or their practices, this is number one way to get fired. yes even if they are completely wrong. your sole job in your job is to make your boss look good. I know it sounds unpopular but this is the way people get promoted vs fired, kind of obvious, but many people still think that if "They do the right thing" that they are clear. This is not something HR will tell you and is against all of our beliefs, but it's the case. If what your boss did is illegal, leave an anonymous tip to the police with evidence making it hard to link it to you but keep private proof that you sent the tip so your are not abiding a crime if it later goes to court.

2. your job quality is derived by 2 factors - a) whether you do something you love, b) the quality of of your direct manager. In your case your boss is an asshole, and you should leave the company regardless.

3. I'm really worried to hear things like "if I get fired, I'll never work in this town again". Where do you live? How powerful is your boss? As a hiring manager, I never got an email list with a subject "people who should never work in this town again".

4. Reporting your boss to HR is a huge risk, it has very low changes of succeeding, but if HR really likes you and really dislike your boss, and you are really a valuable asset to the company more than your boss, than there is a small chance that you'll "win" and get him fired. 9/10, it's going to be you who will be shown the door, but YMMV.

I say - go look for another job, find a manager that will not be a jerk, in a company that promotes openness and good culture. I can't imagine that a data scientist, one of the most sought after and trending jobs in the US will have hard time finding a better job. Am I being delusional?

This. I am no psychologist, but from your post it sounds like you are wound somewhat tight and worry about everything. Not to worry, here are some things to consider.

Losing your job might be the best thing to ever happen to you. What do I mean? Well, for someone who worries a ton, going through a struggle and coming out the other side unscathed will help you worry less and take more risks in the future...which will open you up to new opportunities.

There is a reason many successful people have gone through bankruptcies...It's because they learned the hard way that losing everything financially is not a death sentence...and they come back without fear... Fear is a killer to success. Now's your chance to conquer fear!

Here is a partial list of famous successful people who went through a bankruptcy before succeeding...(From Dan Kennedy's Book, "Wealth Attraction For Entrepreneuers"

P.T. Barnum, David Buick, Walt Disney, James Folger, Henry Ford, Conrad Hilton, J.C. Penny, Sam Walton, William Fox, H.J. Heinz, and Frank Lloyd Wright....

As Pink Says, " Where there is a flame, Someone's bound to get burned. But just because it burns, Doesn't mean you're gonna die. You've gotta get up and try"

Don't worry. Psychologically, this is tough, but by no means the toughest thing I've ever experienced. My head is bloodied, but unbowed. :)

Also, I'd like to urge anyone in my position to seek out help if you feel you need it. A job is merely employment. Important, certainly, but not worth your health and well-being.

>"I know it sounds unpopular but this is the way people get promoted vs fired, kind of obvious, but many people still think that if "They do the right thing" that they are clear"

We need more people to prioritize "doing the right thing" over "getting promoted", not fewer.

Some of us think the system can't be fixed--we just want ours. And that's okay.

Which is what perpetuates these types of things to continue to happen.

Shame some of us are more concerned with providing a living for our families than winning an ideological war right?

let me put it this way, I was doing the "doing the right thing" approach and it hurt me personally, yet I still try to do the right thing, but not via direct criticism, there is an art of how to convey improvement suggestions and feedback to your boss, in tl;dr it is say something good, say constructive criticism, end with something good, and do it all in private.

I never encountered a criminal violation though, so I don't know what I would do, if I would I think I might just tipped HR anonymously and if my boss would like to take me down with him / her, I'll just deny frivolously. Luckily I have a great boss and a great company, but I'm telling you, even the worst bosses and companies still want to be good ones, and if you choose how to give feedback in a way that will not sound too critic, you will win.

Yeah, I second that.

I used to think it was important to "tell the truth" by which I meant saying the things I thought were important to say. In the end, I recognized that was more about me and my feelings than anything.

Now my goal in bringing up some unpleasant but important thing is to make a difference. If I'm going to make a difference, saying the truth isn't the important thing. It's getting somebody to listen to the truth. That is definitely an art.

Doing the right day made me code 10 hour days for two months just to keep up.

The trick is to figure out if its worth it or not, that usually boils down to the the employer.

It wasn't worth it.

R.E. #1. Don't do this.

The company pays you, not your boss. Therefore, you should have the companies best interest in mind, not the personal best interest of your boss. Ideally these two things are aligned. If they are not there is a problem. You can try to fix it (which entails a degree of personal risk, yes), or you can leave. But don't just stay quite. That is disloyalty to the entity which is paying you.

If the company is doing something illegal or strikingly unethical and it is not an oversight and you don't believe change is possible, leave. Otherwise you are complicit and this speaks badly of your character which is worth more than a job.

This is not to say every little issue is worth a battle... nobody and no organization is perfect. Don't be a complainer or a nitpicker. However, if there are major problems don't just go with it. That's how organizations go downhill. People afraid to stand up and take personal risks for the good of the institution. Either try to get it worked out or else walk out. Either way, don't be an enabler.

R.E last paragraph: Exactly!

> That is disloyalty to the entity which is paying you.

My employer is my client, no more, no less. I am employed to produce a set of work for them, and to employ my skills to particular ends as defined in the contract, and that's it. Their relationship with their other contractors is their business.

This idea that because someone pays you to do work you should serve their interests in all things - even to the extent of compromising your own - strikes me as quite perverse. They certainly bear no similar loyalty to you.

Loyalty is a deprecated value I suppose. So let me put it like this... we are riding together in a boat. The boat has a hole in it. Not my problem?

It's your problem, but the situation is not analogous.

If the boat has a hole in, we're both going to drown fairly soon if we don't work together.

If you act in the interests of the company, you take on significant personal risk that you'll be thrown over the side of a boat that may or may not make it to a figurative port - i.e. the company lasts long enough for you to get what you wanted out of the contract - for reporting that someone looked fishy around the engine room.

Don't get me wrong however: Loyalty is valuable. I just choose to assign it to people I respect and who care about me, rather than those who waves a cheque book at me and expect to own my soul when they rent my labour.

I hear you on owning the soul and dis-respectable people. I don't think we should let ourselves be abused. In the case of the original poster, if what he says is accurate (we don't know, we aren't there), he is being abused by a rouge boss who is also creating risk for the company. My opinion is that he should fight this and make others aware of what is going on and try to have it change. Or else leave on his own volition if it is systemic of the larger organization and there is little chance of winning. But don't be abused and don't let the organization that is paying him be abused.

Rather than reporting your boss to HR what are the opinions of others re reporting him to legal / compliance?

You're dealing with Federal compliance issues, odds are there is a nominated person at your company who is responsible for it (there certainly is re money laundering for instance). That means there is probably a company policy saying who you should inform, rather than just telling the person you think is not complying you're often supposed to escalate it.

The danger is to do with what happens if the Feds do come calling, your being fired and not having raised your concerns elsewhere does run the risk of career blowback.

IANAL, or particularly aware of Federal compliance rules.

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