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Comment by proksoup | Hacker News Reader

I have not negotiated my salary or equity ever.

I find difficulty building healthy relationships with the people, men and women, that do negotiate.

I would rather work with other people who want to work somewhere where negotiation for salary is not assumed to be done.

Like, we both got the same offer. They negotiated for a higher salary ... why didn't the employer offer more to start if they thought I was worth more?

If it's too low, say no. If it's enough, say yes.

Why do you want to hire people who negotiate?

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Negotiation shows that you believe you are worth more than the company believes you are worth. Your job is to convince them to make a transaction that, until you prove your worth, is a bad transaction for them.

The ability to successfully negotiate that is similar to a sales pitch. The product you are selling is yourself. Business is about selling an idea, product, or service. If you are incapable of selling yourself - you are not as good an asset for business. Even if hiring into a technical field - what if you make your way to management? What if you end up having to deal with clients directly?

The person who shows they can negotiate is better equipped for those scenarios. They are a better company asset. They are worth more to the company because they offer a skill that is useful for business: negotiation skills.

I think I did an okay job selling myself if we get to the offer stage.

I don't understand why overselling oneself, or convincing the business to make a bad business decision is a valuable trait.

I don't want to work with Alec Baldwin, coffee is for closers, dude seems like a difficult person to work with.

If you get to the offer stage - you met the bare minimum requirements. Depending on the field and other number of applicants - that could mean you have "5 years experience" and not much else. It doesn't always mean you sold yourself best in your resume & cover letter.

It's a bad business decision from their starting perspective. The ability to change their minds and onboard them to invest their time/money into your business is good for your business (or your employers' business). Therefore, companies look for people who are good at negotiation. It's a large part of how business/companies operate. Ever try giving an elevator pitch? A person who can successfully onboard someone in under two minutes is a very, very valuable employee to have because they will be good at winning your business more business.

Overselling yourself or convincing a business to make a bad decision happens sometimes. Not necessarily on purpose! But if a salesman/marketer does this often enough, people stop doing business with them. People prefer to do business when it is mutually beneficial.

Given a choice between two employees of equal merit - the one who can negotiate will always be the more valuable asset to the company. (But then that isn't really equal merit... is it?)

My gripe is that I have no leverage negotiating.

Salary is like the last thing I care about in which employer I choose.

If I like the company, I would take less than they offered probably.

If I don't like the company, I would probably not want to work there no matter the offer.

If I ask for more money, but am unwilling to walk away, I feel like I'm starting the relationship off on a bad foot.

I feel like favoring negotiators favors people who don't care who they work for, and are most interested in money.

It sounds like you should work on your negotiation skills. I'm willing to bet you do have leverage - and if you truly don't - why do you think you deserve as much money as someone who does? If they have more to offer then surely they should be paid more for being better qualified and able to offer more value to the company?

> I feel like favoring negotiators favors people who don't care who they work for, and are most interested in money.

Why not both? I love who I work for and would not leave to any other company that offered equivalent or even slightly better pay. Even if offered much superior pay, I would consult first with my company about a raise to match the offer given before making a decision to leave or not.

If the company I am working for doesn't think I deserve the pay the other company does - chances are I'm going to choose the other company. Simply because being valued is nice. Not being valued or deemed "worth keeping" would make me think I am not wanted at my current company, making leaving for a company that does want me sound rather appealing.

I just had a conversation with a friend about this. He was leaving a country where haggling is the norm, and he wanted to buy some gifts in a hurry, on the way to the airport. So, he tried to say: "I don't have time to haggle; this is my offer; take it or leave it." The TL;DR: it didn't work. He paid more than he wanted and wasted more time. What we figured is that, as with salary, the negotiation is important so everyone feels like they won. Your worth to your employer is only half of the equation. The other half is what you require. Neither are simple, and the point of the negotiation is to find an amount that makes you both happy.

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