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Comment by alecdbrooks | Hacker News Reader

>... At no point, as a consumer of this content, did I get presented with so much as a simple "In return for consuming this content, you agree that you will look at the ads being shown here".

Isn't it common knowledge that many sites rely on ads for their revenue? Sit-down restaurants in the U.S. don't tell you as you walk in that you're expected to tip, but it's common knowledge that wait staff aren't paid minimum wage because customers are expected to tip. Yet, it's generally considered rude to not tip even though it's even easier than installing an ad blocker and restaurants won't refuse you service, whereas some websites try to block ad blockers.

Edit: Added last sentence.

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> Sit-down restaurants in the U.S. don't tell you as you walk in that you're expected to tip, but it's common knowledge that wait staff aren't paid minimum wage because customers are expected to tip.

That's also something the rest of the world scratches its head about. I'm not sure the best way to make your point is to use an example of how absurd the US is.

American tipping isn't a particularly good system, but it's unkind to not tip if it means cheating the wait staff out of their wages.

Similarly, ads have issues, but blocking them is not fair to the creator, who reasonably expected ad impressions in exchange for creating the content and paying for visitors' traffic.

Then why dont you lobby for the government to raise minimum wages for waiters.

We don't tip because their min wage is so low, their minimum wage is so low because we tip.

Tipping is a cultural thing. And practically wait staff make much more from tips than they would if they were paid hourly by their employers.

But isnt it some kind of circular logic to say that, waiters are paid less (by restaurants) because it is common knowledge that they are tipped. And customers must tip, because, they are paid less by their employers. Dont you think it would be simpler if there was no expectation of tips. You know what I think, its the employers who are getting away with cheap labour. It is like some companies that have a variable pay included in the offer, over which the employee has no control.

> it's unkind to not tip if it means cheating the wait staff out of their wages.

Very likely "unkind", but I categorically reject your framing of it as "cheating by the customer".

The practical and ethical responsibility for a livable wage lies with the employer, even if your specific state's laws permit them to violate it.

The real culprits are (collectively) the lawmakers and their donors, who allow this "race to the bottom", followed by the employers who benefit every day from the workers' powerlessness.

Or, to put it another way: "Donate cash to my salaried employee out of pity, so I don't have to pay them for their actual work! If you don't do it, they'll starve and it'll be all your fault!"

Note: That's true only for a minority of the US' individual states.

Every cafe and restaurant in Australia is upfront about the cost of their service and food. I don't think that your example of tipping is a very good one because the rest of the world doesn't operate like that, it's a very American centric view.

I agree with the OP. The content creator was not upfront about wanting money and used adverts, and we are within our right to say no, I'm not lowering myself to watch this advert.

It's time we accept that adverts are not the solution.

In addition, is it just me or are most adverts just crap and garbage that lower the overall experience every time?

I'm in Australia at the moment. Just a couple things I find refreshing, besides a generally more laid back attitude about a lot of trivialities:

* No tipping. Employers are required to pay a living wage. ($17-21/hour, depending on some factor)

* Sales tax is included in the price. No "add x% at the register" crap.

> it's common knowledge that wait staff aren't paid minimum wage because customers are expected to tip

"Common"? No it isn't. ~65% of Americans live in states where that would be ILLEGAL, and those employers would be committing the crime of wage-theft.

http://www.dol.gov/whd/state/tipped.htm

Maybe the real problem is your state's laws.

As the sage once said, "your failed business model is not my problem". If someone wants to spend time and money making stuff and instructing a web server to give it away for free, on the gamble that people who want that stuff might also download a bunch of ads, it is not my responsibility to ensure that their gamble pays off by acting according to their predictions.

I don't know about where you are, but your state's (failure of a) business model is not my concern.

Where I am, at the very least, wait staff are required to be paid minimum wage, like (almost) everyone else.

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