Pebble Reveals Pebble Time Steel and a Smartstrap System | Hacker News Reader

Pebble Reveals Pebble Time Steel and a Smartstrap System

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67 pointsyatoomy62 comments

I've been continually impressed with Pebble since their very first Kickstarter. They've done a lot on a few levels:

- For smartwatches (and possibly even wearables) they produced and shipped what I'd consider to be the first mainstream phone-connected wearable. I'm sure it was on the big players' radar but Pebble produced a decent product relatively on time and I'm sure people learned quite a bit from them. At the least they showed their was a market.

- For crowdfunding: Pebble got a MASSIVE stack of money. Way beyond what anyone expected. They managed the sudden increase in scale well, and I think showed that startups could be funded to the tune of $millions rather than $tens-of-thousands.

- For hardware startups: Pebble showed that an independent startup can compete (and continue to compete) with giants who have a vast existing customer base. And that funding is available for that endeavour. I also think they set the standard for communicating with customers. I still remember their updates from factories in China. I think they blazed something of a trail for companies that followed (Amp, Navdy, Ouya, off the top of my head).

Smartwatches aren't for me - I've lost every watch I've ever owned - but I'm in awe of this team.

> Pebble produced a decent product relatively on time

Their branding is great. Now whenever i see "time", it reminds me of the watch...

I would add that Pebble gave away a ton of free Pebbles to universities[1]. This boosted their app production, and made them super popular. Everyone on my campus was like, "awesome, you got a pebble!" it made something to be desired, and makes you stand out as a CS or ECE major.

I know I am purchasing a Pebble because I was so impressed by the free one they gave me.

[1] https://blog.getpebble.com/2013/12/16/pebbling-schools-in-th...

I've lost every watch I've ever owned

I've lost every watch I've ever owned, except for the irreplaceable vintage Rolex my Dad gave me. I keep that in a case in a drawer!

So, Pebble calls it "Smartstrap", but the TC article for some reason uses the names "Smartband" and "Smartstrap".

The Kickstarter page doesn't mention it by either, but the Pebble blog post (http://developer.getpebble.com/blog) that the TC article references still links back to the Kickstarter page as a source. The blog post shows an image of connectors, but doesn't specify what the four lines do (I'm guessing two are for power and two are for data).

So confused right now.

I'm a backer of the Pebble Time and received this announcement as a Kickstarter project update. In pebble's own words, they call it a smartstrap.

  Introducing Pebble smartstraps

  We believe your smartwatch should help you accomplish more every day.

  When we started Pebble, we opened up the platform and invited the software   
  developer community to build remarkable experiences for Pebblers everywhere.

  Looking at all the amazing things our developers have created over the last 2 years,   
  we decided to open the platform once more...only this time, for hardware developers.

  Have you ever wanted to go for a run without your phone and still track your speed  
 and distance? How about a Pebble watch with a battery life of more than a week?   
  What about a NFC chip for payments, keyless car remote, or a pollution sensor?

  Rather than trying to shove every sensor and doohickey into the Pebble Time, we decided   
  to keep the watch simple and functional and give our incredible maker and developer community the opportunity to build from there.  
 Up until now, if you wanted it all you had to compromise…on battery life, size, design or feature set. Not anymore.

  That’s why we created Pebble smartstraps. It’s simple: straps can now contain  
 electronics and sensors to interface directly with apps running on Pebble Time.

Are you by any chance finding it impossible to upgrade your pledge to the Pebble Time Steel? Kickstarter is really crapping out on me today.

I was having trouble, but eventually got through just minutes ago. Could be fixed now, or I just got lucky.

Yeah their status page said they were looking into it though. Definitely not just you.

This page (https://developer.getpebble.com/smartstraps/, linked in the blog post) has a little bit more detail.

There's not much details yet on the API, which is likely only for "is connected" or "start this app", but my guess is that most of the work is left up to the hardware developer, a la most hardware dev. Not so much API calls but straight reading IO pins. I'd pick up an Arduino for an idea of what you'd be getting into.

I'd be surprised if they didn't realize some SDKs to make working with whatever protocol they come up with easier.

Judging from the first time around, they give people just enough SDK to get started, and then develop the SDK in parallel with the community releasing products.

About two years ago they were telling people to unzip a file in their home directory and put arm-none-eabi-gcc in $PATH:

http://web.archive.org/web/20130416000246/http://developer.g...

Two for ground, one for (bidirectional) power and a one-wire serial bus.

I like the idea of smart watches, but I don't see why there would be a demand for them. Specifically, I can't think of a single "killer app" that would make a smart watch better than the phone that everyone is currently carrying around.

Can someone enlighten me? Whats going to be the killer app for smart watches?

I can speak of the one I'm developing.

We're using the Pebble to track seizures through the accelerometer (neutun.com).

With these new bands, and the amazing battery life, we could have multiple device and signal support, allowing us to branch out to other types of seizures and conditions.

Cool. That's sort of the opposite of a killer app.

We have users buying Pebbles for the soul purpose of using our application, that would otherwise not have purchased it.

He was making a joke as your app saves lives instead of being a "killer".

ahah sorry, about that @jkestner. Thanks for the clarification @robwilliams. Guess thats what I get for reading fast! :P

That's what I get for being pithy. By the way, are you aware of the Embrace wearable that's doing it the other way? Seizure sensor first, watch second. Handsome and minimalist.

https://www.empatica.com

Yup, we are well aware :)

I can't label a "killer app", but smart watches have opportunities a smartphone doesn't. The most obvious is the opportunity for biometrics, as they rest on your skin.

Thats a truth few wearable companies understand. Many just shove the same functionality of the phone onto your wrist, which is the worst of both worlds. They miss out on the unique opportunities wearables have and focus on smartphone features that are sub-optimal (at best) for a wearable.

Pebble is the leader in this way of thinking. They are showing more innovation than Apple with the announcement of the smartbands. Opening up a world of possibilities for software and hardware engineers/ideas

Specifically which biometrics? Perhaps the sensors still need to be invented but what would you like to track regardless of technical feasibility?

I'm not close enough to biometrics to know what is truly feasible, but I would think you might be able to get SPO2, bpm, EKG, body temperature, maybe even hydration... Then from there you can start building second-order measurements, like how much time you spend at your resting HR, how quickly you return to resting HR, how well your lungs are working, sleep activity. From there maybe you could even extrapolate that data to give feedback. "Dave, your temperature has been gradually increasing the last 36 hours and your skin is unusually clammy, you might be on the verge of a cold" Or maybe "Dave, your SPO2 is falling and your bpm is rising rapidly, you are going into shock, seek medical attention immediately". History is useful for these measurements- what is "normal" is different from person to person, so a running history could let you discover these things earlier.

Killer app? I don't know about killer, but here are some super useful things I can imagine smartwatches doing:

1. Use as a navigation device (walking, driving, biking, etc), so you don't have to constantly pull your phone our and check which way to go.

2. Control music / tv / computer from across the room without needing a remote (always on your hand, always paired)

3. Homekit control (lighting, locks, appliances, etc) e.g. set your oven to preheat, go in the backyard and do whatever, watch notifies you when over is ready

4. Healthkit (many people wear health trackers already, this will just bring more features to a device they already wear). Also biometrics.

5. Someone texts / calls / emails you as you sit in a meeting / walking with your hands full / etc you can glance at your wrist and see how important the notification is before you excuse yourself to take the call or whatever.

Basically, most of the potential with this device is doing things which phones can already do but in a less intrusive manner. These features alone interest me in smartwatches; I can't imagine what other people will come up with.

Killer app? I don't know about killer, but here are some super useful things I can imagine smartwatches doing:...Basically, most of the potential with this device is doing things which phones can already do but in a less intrusive manner.

We shouldn't ever dismiss this avenue for product/business development: Duplicating an existing functionality/service but with greater convenience. One of the charges raised against both the iPhone and iPad, was that they merely duplicated functionality that was already in other devices. However, making that functionality more convenient and mobile turned out to be of incredible value to the market.

There are three things for me (this is just my subjective account):

1) Ease of receiving texts. Reading a text went from 7 seconds to 1.7 seconds for me. Really nice while driving (I can keep my eyes near the road and not be mentally distracted) or when I'm in lab with latex gloves on ("Oh yes, I do want to get lunch in 5 mins, good thing I saw this"). BTW, if my time is worth $50/hr and I get 100 texts a day, saving 5.3 seconds per text, the $250 watch pays for it self in 33 days.

2) Social implications of checking your phone vs checking your watch. The latter is impatient, but the former is outright rude in many contexts.

3) By filtering the important things through my watch rather than my phone, if my phone buzzes but my watch doesn't, I can safely ignore it, because it is of lower-tier importance. This benefit surprised me, but it is actually rather nice to have an automatic hierarchy of notification importance.

re #2, I would argue that both, done repeatedly, are considered to be outright rude in many contexts.

Pebble is unique in this early smartwatch space because they just became a hardware platform in addition to being a software platform. If the smartbands are easy enough to change and provide a significant variety of meaningful functionality it might be the advantage that wins out over the other two major platforms.

The win here would be to get acquired by... Amazon?

I think I prefer the regular Pebble Time. It already includes a stainless steel bezel, although the rest of the case is plastic. I'd use a custom strap no matter which watch I got. And 7 days is a long enough battery life for me -- I'd rather have the thinner watch than the longer battery life.

Where is the thickness mentioned? I looked but couldn't find anything about it.

The Steel is 1mm thicker than the regular Time

The Pebble Time is 9.5 mm [0], and Pebble Time Steel 1mm thicker, making it 10.5mm [1]. 10.5mm is actually as thick as the current Pebble Steel so it's actually not bad.

[0] https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/597507018/pebble-time-a...

[1] https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/597507018/pebble-time-a...

That's pretty amazing when you consider that Apple Watch will be about 12.4mm thick with the heart sensor included and high end traditional watches can be anywhere between 11 and 13mm.

Apparently kickstarter didn't get the memo. Site buckling under pressure.

It's completely down right now, showing varnish errors.

Weird, since it worked pretty well on the original Pebble Time launch.

They might have bumped up the capacity for that, and then spun down afterwards not realizing they would get swamped today.

Kickstarter is crawling right now. I'm trying to change my pledge and it's pretty awful.

I keep getting errors when trying to switch to the plastic/steel combo. And when I retry, the number of displayed pledges keeps going down. Despite errors on the page, I got an email saying my pledge had been changed.

That gold one with a red band is a bit reminiscent of another smart watch coming out soon. (And plenty of existing non smart watches, of course.)

Finnally I am convinced. I loved the color e-paper display and one week battery life. Now I don't feel geeky to wear one either.

And the battery life is even better on the Pebble Time Steel (10 days).

It may not be successful, but I really think Pebble has the right idea with smartwatches.

I really hope that the smartwatch industry doesn't devolve into the monoculture that is the smartphone industry (well, technically a 2 platform culture, but Android and iOS are basically 2 sides of the same coin now. Neither one offers anything the other doesn't).

Funny how Android got more iOS like while iOS was getting more Android like. (Talking both functionality and degree of openness.)

I don't want to wait an extra 2 months, so I think I'll stick with the regular Time and hand it down to my wife when the Steel is in stock, retail. She doesn't want the Steel version anyway and would be happy with an upgrade to her Pebble.

The smartstraps are going to be really cool -- a lot of potential there.

FYI, they mention that if you back the Time + Time Steel (@$400), they ship them separately "so you don't have to wait". I might end up doing that >:D

And now you have me pondering this...

Hm that's also a $10 discount off of one of them (at their lowest pledge tiers)

Very smart of them to release a gold version. If watches are all about fashion, and people want a gold-colored watch because they like how it looks, they probably can't afford it from Apple.

It may be seen as a copy by some, but a $5000 product is not competing with a $300 one.

Revealing it this way leaves a bad taste in my mouth. At the very least, I'm glad that they revealed it during the main campaign rather than shortly after, but it's a pretty significant shift in the campaign. It's like an even bigger "fuck you" to the Kickstarter model, because clearly they knew they'd be doing this.

Plus, it resulted in a big shuffling around of orders, which means a bunch of people were able to "cut in line" and get the extra discounted Early Bird level.

Though all of that is only in regards to the Steel model, I'm actually extremely interested in the Smartstrap system, and I'll definitely be interested in tinkering around with it once I receive my only slightly discounted non-steel Pebble Time.

I wonder why didn't Pebble user Mirasol instead of e-ink.

They're still calling the color display "e-paper", which in the case of the original Pebble meant a Sharp Memory LCD display (which, while a high-contrast LCD, looked nothing like the e-ink displays in e-readers.)

Based on the appearance of the display, it looks a lot like the color transflective displays found on older portable Nintendo game systems, so I'm guessing it's relative of those.

That's what it looked like to me as well. Here's an example[1]. These displays can be either back lit or front lit and don't get washed out in sunlight.

[1] http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/a5cc0b92eb2febb051740c...

Mirasol doesn't seem to have been adopted very much, outside of the Qualcomm Toq watch. I wonder if it's not very impressive in person, or pricey.

I believe the latter. FWIW, Qualcomm's marketing demo/presentation was very impressive.

I get that Pebble is trying to milk this (marketing-wise) for all it's worth but this leaves a bad taste in my mouth... Should I also expect that next week they will announce the "Pebble Time Steel +" ??

Now I have to decide if I want to pay $70 more and wait 2 more months (best case).... If you thought Pebble was abusing KS before....

So don't get me wrong I love my Pebble Steel and I'm a backer for the new Pebble Time I just don't like how they are handling this.

Would you have preferred if they delayed the Pebble Steel Time a few more months so you could feel better about your order? You could switch your order to the Pebble Steel Time right now. I don't see how this adversely affects you at all.

I would have liked it if they would have dropped it all at the same time, this is obviously a marketing move to keep their KS relevant. I was on the fence on "Should Pebble be allowed to use KS are their e-commerce platform" and this pushed me over the edge. They didn't add a tier b/c they it some goal, they added it because it was planned from the start. I like to have all my options available to me when I make a decision and with Pebble it's not clear if we have more surprises in store. This means that I have to re-evaluate my options and I've got better things to do then re-decide what I want every week when they add/change KS reward tiers. Just my opinion and obviously not a popular one here on HN...

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