Did GCHQ illegally spy on you? | Hacker News Reader

Did GCHQ illegally spy on you?

privacyinternational.org

64 pointsxvirk24 comments

Page seems unclear about what the actual intent is. First it simply says "demanding that they finally come clean" i.e. inform you if your communications have been intercepted, but then you have to agree "...to request my records to be deleted."

What if I want to know the former, just out of curiosity, but I'm not that bothered about demanding my records be deleted, depending on what was intercepted?

Not that unclear on a closer look. From the FAQ at https://privacyinternational.org/?q=node/495 :

"Why are we doing this?

Intelligence agencies' culture of secrecy have allowed them, for too long, to avoid public accountability. Whether it’s secret hearings in closed court rooms or committees equipped only with rubber stamps, intelligence agencies like GCHQ have never been forced to answer to the public for their actions.

We think you have a right to know whether you have been caught up in GCHQ and NSA's illegal intelligence sharing. If so, you have a right to demand that data be deleted. Privacy International wants to help you assert those rights."

Exactly my first thought. I'd love to sign off on the first part of that, but "...to request my records to be deleted." Not so sure I want that (which goes to show I guess that I'm more concerned with the rule of law than the actual "privacy" of my communications).

It feels like a reinvention of Pascal's wager to guarantee we don't sign up:

a) if I'm worried then I want to sign up but not hand over my details

b) if I'm not worried then I don't mind handing over my details but uninterested in signing up

But this makes it more important that regular people ask about their details.

It sends the message that it's not just people with paranoia and terrorists that don't want a pervasive surveillance society, and that it's a normal everyday desire to not have your government spying on you.

GCHQ will always want to slurp more data; they will rarely err on the side of less data.

I used to be relaxed about central government spying, and less relaxed about local authorities using surveillance to check bins or school catchment areas, and less relaxed still about US companies ignoring the concepts of privacy. The failure of "them" to protect us from known radicals has made me a bit less relaxed about government spying.

Last thing I want is for GCHQ to know that I'm worried about them spying on me. Then I will properly be spied on.

I feel the same, which is very concerning.

Yeah, I don't really have any faith in legal redress so while I support the intent behind this, I'm wary about actually filling it in.

This is exactly the point of having such a system. They should be so proud it's working so well. When we were told the aim was to silence the dissatisfied citizens, we had doubts.

But just think about it now, you're a dissatisfied citizen, and a silent one.

Your call, but consider that the best time possible to push back is in coordination with others.

I have no doubt you and I both are already 'properly' spied on. The Five Eyes agencies won't be taken to task for their transgressions by us hiding from them. At least this way we can contribute to an effort towards forcing them back under rule of law, finding out what they have collected and demand to have these records deleted.

I'm signing this with every address I have.

> Your call, but consider that the best time possible to push back is in coordination with others.

Maybe they should include a volume promise? For example: "We'll only take action if at least 100,000 sign up, and only then file all contact details all together. If we don't achieve this number by x/y/2015, we will not use your details without further permission from you, and will delete your details within 90 days of that date unless you tell us we can do otherwise."

Why does volume protect you? Most of this spying is automated. It doesn't make much difference to them if there are 1,000; 10,000 or 100,000 people on this list. There are already too many people of interest for GCHQ / etc to monitor individually effectively. And that group is only about a thousand people.

What do users who don't want to sign a petition have to do to find out if we've been spied on?

The FAQ actually has a suggestion for that as well.

Consider submitting a complaint here: http://www.ipt-uk.com/section.aspx?pageid=16

Probably, but I'll never know through this means because privacyinternational decided to rely on a javascript dependent page rendering.

I didn't want to take part the first time I saw this (linked to by sctb below) but on closer inspection and reading the comments this time around convinced me.

Still not sure if I'll get to see what was collected, but at least confirmation will be interesting.

"How could we get a list of people who are afraid of being spied on, and therefore are suspicious?"

Surely you wouldn't be worried if you had nothing to hide!

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9057846

The site isn't responding but I was assuming it would just come up with a 'Yes' in a similiar way to http://www.howmanypeopleareinspacerightnow.com/ OR http://isberthastillstuck.com/

Collecting details?

Ha. Nice try GCHQ :P /s

That looks like some sort of bait ;)

probably

Yes?

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say the answer is Yes. For me anyway. :P

Reply on news.ycombinator.com