Comment by nakedrobot2 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by nakedrobot2 | Hacker News Reader

Here in the Czech Republic, there is no forced smile. It is not a part of the culture, people generally don't do it, and people here generally see americans (especially americans) as fake, superficial, and insincere.

I'm a bit on the fence about it. Central Europeans, including Czechs are a rather gloomy bunch :-) especially in the winter. Americans are definitely more cheerful, and it is not fake. Ok, sometimes it is but generally speaking Americans are in fact more cheerful and optimistic. Ok, Czechs have five centuries of being conquered and subjugated of course, so let's not draw too many conclusions.

In terms of smiling strangers, well, I'd like a bit more of it than we have here in the Czech Republic (where there is very little)

Ha, five centuries! We Slovenians have had 12. From 828 AD to 1991 AD.

But yes, us Slavs are a gloomy bunch. But only on the outside and only to strangers. Particularly Americans. Whenever I'm in the States I commonly get accused of being emotionless and of having a deadpan face. At the same time, I feel everybody I meet there is a clown and I always make sure to tune down their enthusiasm. If an American says something is super awesome and the best thing ever, it's probably kinda okayish.

Anyway, the interesting thing I've found comparing Slavs to Americans is that while Slavs are weary of strangers, they open up much sooner. You can be friends with Americans for months and years, but if you haven't gone to the same kindergarten together, you will never be a true friend. Whereas with Slavs, you could have met at a bar three hours ago, and already you're confessing your deepest darkest secrets to each other and are practically best friends.

Source: having lived in the States for some time

PS: to be fair, most Europeans I've met both in Europe and in the US share this immediately friends trait. So far none of the Americans I've met have, possibly because of The Big City effect.

you're european, so you can make instant-friends with europeans quite easily.

i'm american, and i can make instant friends with americans. i did it throughout my 20s when traveling here in the US and overseas. in fact i've done it all over 4 continents now. this doesn't seem to be a racial or cultural trait. some people are friendly, some aren't.

perhaps the fact that you describe yourself as 'gloomy' is the reason americans do not find it easy to befriend you even after a few drinks.

> perhaps the fact that you describe yourself as 'gloomy' is the reason americans do not find it easy to befriend you even after a few drinks.

Funnily, Europeans have started labeling me as too cheery, smiley, and direct. Too American.

And yes, it could well be the sense of common cultural heritage at play here. But Europeans in general don't have as much of a common heritage as Americans do, and we all grew up on American culture anyway. Particularly for everyone growing up in the 90's when American stuff was extremely popular here as we were trying to be less like The Old System (tm) and embrace The Capitalism (tm).

Although there are a lot of differences in observing a culture and actually living it. I'll grant you that.

At the end of the day, this is anecdata. Your mileage may vary.

I'm a gloomy American and it's typical for me to make friends with Slavs, but I'm not really a "fast friends" kind of person.

As a Slav, I actually really enjoy giving and receiving smiles (from strangers and friends). Also, I find Americans (especially in the service sector) a lot more smiley and cheery than Canadians, so it's more than US vs Europe, I think it's a uniquely US trait (I lived in all three)

I found this bit interesting: "Admittedly, the dynamism of Western capitalism depends upon people who work with missionary zeal, who refuse to accept that a job is merely a job. It must be something more — a vocation, an adventure, a journey to higher heights."

He has something there. Easiest way to make people your slaves (this is a metaphor, in case it's not obvious) it's to convince them that pushing papers in some dreary cubicle for peanuts is somehow a mission, a source of pride.

In the immortal words of Antoine de Saint-Exupery:

“If you want to build a ship, don’t drum up the men to gather wood, divide the work, and give orders. Instead, teach them to yearn for the vast and endless sea.”

We are? I mean, perhaps, on the tram, people are neutral. And cashiers don't smile, ever.

But whenever you see a group of Czechs doing something, we are all laughs and smiles. Friends, colleagues, coworkers ... even at work, we spend a lot of time telling stupid jokes, laughing and goofing around.

There's no forced smile, no, but there's a lot of fun.

In terms of cultural comparison, I find that the Anglo-Saxon culture is more about making friends, not discussing iffy topics etc. While as Czechs we will totally argue. Maybe that's where the gloomy/smiley split comes from.

I don't know how we are in relation to Czechs, but one of things I hear as an American is that we are often too quick to talk about politics. Whereas, in many cultures, politics is considered almost taboo to talk about with all but the closest friends and family.

Huh, I guess maybe it only applies to British, Canadians and Kiwis?

I have a friend who consciously does not want to talk about taboo topics because then she could find out her friends are assholes...

I tell this to Americans because I don't want to hear their views on politics.

You should talk to more Americans. It's a country of three hundred million people and there is a continuum of political opinion ranging from extreme to extreme. It sounds like you're heavily invested in your perception though.

One thing I have found interesting is that as you go more north in the US, a culture of explicit niceness becomes palpable. I have always though weather may have some relationship, as Canada by reputation would fit this view.

Interesting, my experience has been the opposite. On the west coast I find that people from San Diego are, on average, a bit more cheery than people from Seattle. Similarly, the average resident of New Orleans seems to have a rosier outlook on life than the average Manhattanite or Montrealer.

As a Northerner living in the South, I will tell you that Northerners are painfully conscious of how they treat and are perceived by others and try to minimize their impact on other people. Southern Hospitality is mostly fake and really more about trying to size you up and figure out details about your life (but yes, in some areas people will go way out of their way to help you out with stuff).

New Orleans residents are outliers. They are far and away the friendliest people I've met anywhere in the US, but at the same time it's a tourist economy and everyone seems to have a hustle. Much love for New Orleans.

As a Northern living in the South, I've found the exact opposite. People seem to be more friendlier down here.

Let's make some more generalizations.

Just wait. They'll learn ya. :)

As a Texan who moved to New York City for the summer I really missed Southern hospitality (and Tex-Mex). When I came back to Texas the Southern hospitality did feel fake until I got used to it again. Although some of it probably is fake, I think most of it is genuine. Just like when I moved to NY it seemed like everybody was a depressed workaholic, when in reality that they are probably as you say trying "to minimize their impact on other people". Likewise I'm sure Southerners come off as fake until you get used to the culture. The pace of life is much slower and people love to make small talk. Also we don't ask people how their day is going so that we can figure out details about their life and judge them. Its just a nice thing to do.

About that last point, for me it's more that the mere mention of someone (as in, i'm trying to relate a story and mention someone as a minor character) brings up questions like "what's their full name?" and stuff about who their family is because they're trying to figure out if they know the person. Everyone talks about everyone else's personal business here and there is no expectation of privacy. For someone coming from a big anonymous city like New York, that's incredibly violating.

Could still be weather as the Parent stated. San Diego, warmer, nice weather. Seattle, rainy, snowy, gloomy, could be Seasonal Depressive/affective Disorder from not enough sunlight.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com