Gee willickers, I sure am glad nothing like that happens here in the good old US of A.
How often are we going to repeat this point?
Okay, as slowly and clearly as I can:
"Two wrongs don't make a right."
Just because the US does bad thing X, doesn't mean we can't talk about another country doing bad thing X.
Please, for the love of baby Jesus and his family. Please. Please.
I won't even top it off with a "the country's people are not the same as its government," or anything like it. I just beg of you, please, please stop using this line of reasoning.
I'm so exhausted of seeing it. It wears me down.
PS: GP has a point, he sketches the context. Fine. "Russia is not the only one, also US." Okay, it's true. But when you say "don't talk about Russia, because US!" then no. No, no, no, no. No.
EDIT: Can't reply to "rational-future", so I'll say it here: No, not at all. The opposite. As I said: "GP has a point". My problem is here:
> Furthermore, people should be concerned with their own country's criminality, not hypocritically pointing the finger at official enemies like Russia.
This is wrong. Telling people to shut up because their government / countrymen / ... does the same thing. Sure, call them out for being hypocrites. But even hypocrites have a right to speak. So, yeah: do talk about the US. Sure. Give me context. As long as you leave all the room for the original discussion.
To answer your question, just because something is "wrong" doesn't mean something can't be more "wrong". Just because I jaywalked yesteday doesn't mean I'm on the same level as a meth dealer, for example.
Life isn't black and white, it's shades of grey. Something can be much darker than another thing. And it's OK to point that out. As is the case here. The U.S media certainly isn't up to snuff, but the situation in Russia and other state-owned news agenicies are absolutely horrible by comparison. There may be poverty in the U.S but that doesn't mean it's on the same level as in a country like Ethiopia.
As much as the Russian defenders want to equate the two, they are NOT comparable.
It's only hypocritical if you don't also point the finger at your own flaws. Which people in this forum do. A lot.
Besides, not everyone agrees anymore with the notion that they must "have a country". What's my country? I have double nationality, and I live in an union of 28 countries. Lots of us work and live moving from country to country. And I feel more at home with some people here than with the average citizen of my city.
I still hold a soft spot for the place I grew up in, but I don't consider myself tied to it. It's not mine, nor do I belong to it.
EDIT: My ignorance was showing. Thanks, Atropos.
The superiority of western media over what is available from Russia or similar countries is not in the honesty and quality of any single media outfit, but in the plurality of media voices.
In the west, there are so many channels, shows, magazines and online sites, financed by completely different means, often pulling in different political directions, that most attempts at disinformation are discovered sooner rather than later.
We in the west are far more brainwashed than we think...
We never really know the truth. I can tell you what I ate this morning, and I can tell you that the sky is blue (maybe blue-greyish today).
The point is that too many people believe what they see on CNN, and assume it's the absolute truth. People base their world view upon curated news without questioning anything.
Here's a great interview by Larry King on his Ora TV network (re-broadcast online by RT): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv2f6ZZmx4A
In it, Stephen Cohen (the guest) makes the point that there's little debate in the western media these days. Either you agree, or you agree more. No one questions anything anymore.
Russians will tell you everything is a lie not because everything in Russia IS a lie (some things are, some aren't - much like over here), but because it's part of Russian culture, their outlook on the world, to be cynical and critical of everything.
One poster brought up that RT is trying to discredit everything, but that's not really correct. Russians question everything, it's a part of slavic culture, hell my 92 year old Ukrainian grandfather who's been here his whole life shares that outlook.
We in the west though have been transformed into gullible sheep, who question nothing we're told because we are comfortable working our 9-5 (more like 7-6) job to pay off our credit cards and debt, while watching shitty TV shows and never finding the motivation to ever learn about anything...
Find me a US news outlet which, say, criticizes the preposterous influence of Saudi and Israeli intelligence services on the US political process (say, for example, the invasion of Iraq and the demonization of Syria and Iran), and I will say we have a freer news organization in the US. Or, for example, the fact that the US organized a coup against a democratically elected government in Ukraine, and put Joe Biden's son in charge of an oil company there: kind of like a corrupt oligarchy would. Meanwhile, if I want to read about this, Russia Today, despite being Russian propaganda, actually accurately reports on the subject. Which is why people welcome RT as a useful news outlet, and laugh at CNN as US propaganda.
As for "no dissenting media, conquering foreign territory, tolerating extreme corruption etc" -I can't tell which country you're talking about. Whenever I hear some slavophobe ranting about the Russians, it seems some peculiar case of projection.
I do see a few groups of people trying to do something different, but they get stomped upon quicker than when I was a kid(in the 70's).
Yes, I know the Machine would breakdown if we didn't put so much into our energy into conforming to society, but just the amount of conformity we currently have is troubling. I'm being vague because I could go on for pages with examples. No, I don't see quite the same level of conformity online, but that herd mentality still seems to win? I've noticed even on HN there are some people who don't post honest alternative views like they used too? I'm not talking arguing just for the sake of arguing either, but I want to hear(within reason) the dissenters too. I can't because they get blurred out so quickly?
I am not a good writer, and having a hard time conveying what I am seeing. I just see people living lives they don't really want, or striving for a life they think they want. Some doing Horrid things in order to get ahead, and when they do get ahead legally--they still do Horrid things in order to stay ahead.(I see this absolute greed in so many families during probate/Trust proceedings. I see well off family members essentially putting brothers and sisters on the streets--over money. I don't get it? They rationalize, and just because it's legal--They proceed?) And some are so distraught chasing the good life they are brought to killing themselfs for something they think they want?
Again--I'm not a good writer, and lost focus, but just the level of conformity to get that perfect mate, house, perfect health, and job seems like it might backfire? I think media plays a huge role in conforming society. Maybe because Russian media is so obvious, it is having the opposite effect, while American media influence is so vague, we fall into their trap in the end? Yes, I know we have the most money, but are we happy?
(emphasis mine)