Hacker News Reader

Comment by inclemnet | Hacker News Reader

> hardly an unreasonable request. He doesn't ask for a "review," of the exam, and this seems like it should take all of two seconds

It doesn't change the context that the instructor isn't being paid to do it - he says he's already spent more time on the course than contracted. From his point of view, it's not an unreasonable request that he should not spent more of his (insufficiently remunerated) time on even small issues.

> and would be understandably pissed off if I was given no opportunity to collect an exam I'd taken.

But does that make it reasonable to blame a guy who's not paid to help you for not helping you?

I do understand the nature of your point, but I don't think any of the original argument is actually affected by the size of the task he's refusing to do.

View on HN

If he holds office hours regularly (as the email seems to imply), then there is nothing extra he has to do but let the student find his exam in the pile.

So...nothing except something? This takes time and effort, even if just a little, and I suspect it adds up more than you guess. And all unpaid - an actual loss, in fact, since it distracts from whatever he's currently working on.

I do see why you argue this way, and I might agree except that I also would give weighting to the moral point he's making. Staff like this are systematically exploited, and working to contract is a classic way to try to demonstrate why they should be better supported - it's a direct attempt to make a larger point, not just a random choice to annoy a few students.

I'd agree with the broader point that this guy is making, he's being exploited by the university, and doesn't owe the school any additional work.

That being said, he does owe his students the chance to at least look at the culmination of their semester's work. I know at my university, professors are obligated to have exams available for at least a year past the date they were taken! Maybe if allowing students to look at their exams would truly take an additional 75 hours of his time as claimed, he'd have a stronger case, but that's simply not true. If the student was requesting him to explain why a problem was wrong, or engage with this exam in anyway, I'd be completely in agreement. Hell, he could just put them all in a box outside his door, or maybe leave them with the departmental secretary (this happens all the time), or come up with some sort of solution.

His broader point still stands, but this is absolutely part of the responsibilities of a teacher, and I can't get behind this guy making a point at the expense of his students.

It is possible that they only allow an exam to be seen with the professor present and then it is held onto afterwards.

The thing is, he is already well over the budgeted hours. Sure this is a small thing, but there were probably a whole heap of other little things in the previous 50 hours he put in where he made things better for students. The line has to be drawn somewhere.

Are commuters to blame for the poor working conditions in the public transport industry? No. Do commuters suffer when conductors go on strike? Yes. Does it work? Yes. Does complaining to your boss work? No. Its unfortunate but at the end of the day the only thing he can use (apart from quitting outright) as leverage is malicious compliance, which includes working the exact hours your paid and nothing more.

I feel for the student, but a workers' rights are more important to me. If I were in the students position I would be pissed, but not at the professor but at the institution. The same way I don't get mad at conductors going on strike because of poor working conditions even if I have already bought a ticket.

The 75 hours was also in reference to allowing every student to do the same (you either allow all students to have a look, or none), and I can tell from experience that it will end up taking quite a bit of time. Most students mean "could you go over the exam with me" when they ask to review their exam. Just having them glance at the red markings will generally not do them much good anyway. And putting them in a box for pick-up (while also being more unpaid work) is generally not allowed in my opinion. The university holds on to the exams for administrative purposes, meaning he would have to supply photocopies instead.

(Source: TAing and TAing friends)

Reply on news.ycombinator.com