Comment by einhverfr | Hacker News Reader

Comment by einhverfr | Hacker News Reader

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> So instead of temporary staff, they take people off of their current projects to work in customer service?? This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.

Why not? It improves solidarity. Actually when I worked at Microsoft doing tech support, I got pulled off the phones to help with sudden mandatory tech support rotations due to virus outbreaks. It was great to see marketing managers have to help people assess whether their systems were infected and apply appropriate tools. I would take escallations but generally people did a good job. (Oh and these people showed up with very little training on customer service or tech support so that was fun).

But I think one thing that Microsoft got out of it (this was in 2002-2003) was a stronger sense by everyone why it was important to focus more on system security. I think this improved the company and lead to better software.

> Especially since I've been in positions where I have been on tight deadlines.

If management know of the rotation, they will have to adjust the deadlines. How many deadlines are really necessary beyond a simple measurement rationale? Management can usually adjust as needed, or reschedule the rotation to a better point.

> With me, it's difficult to move from customer service right back to software development/engineering.

Isn't the point though to ensure that people are engineering and developing software with customer service in mind?

"Why not? It improves solidarity."

There are plenty of better ways to do this.

"I got pulled off the phones to help with sudden mandatory tech support rotations due to virus outbreaks."

It doesn't sound like you are in any kind of engineering role. When you are on the phones, you don't have one large project to work on with deadlines and due dates. It's easy for you to be shifted over to another position.

"If management know of the rotation, they will have to adjust the deadlines. How many deadlines are really necessary beyond a simple measurement rationale? Management can usually adjust as needed, or reschedule the rotation to a better point."

This sounds like a nightmare to deal with. In addition to tight deadlines as a manager, I now have to deal with customer service rotations?? It's hard enough to get projects completed with upper management changing scope (which has happened at pretty much any place I've worked over the last 15 years).

"Isn't the point though to ensure that people are engineering and developing software with customer service in mind?"

I'm fine with this as long as management realizes that deadlines will need to change and it might take a couple of days (or even a week) to get back into the flow of a project that an engineer/developer has been taken off for customer support. In my experience, management doesn't know or care about either of these things and thinks you can just move people around when needed.

I'm glad I run my own company now, so I don't have to deal with this bullshit any longer. I would never implement something like this.

The basic thing is:

If management is going to be realistic, they can't leave deadlines unadjusted and still expect rotations through other departments.

But if you want a good business, you need to cross-train, which means this sort of rotation. That's something Toyota learned, something Etsy has learned, and something Microsoft inadvertantly reinvented if by accident.

I think the better way to put it is: it improves empathy.

More often than not, in large teams or organisations there is often a culture of blame or lack of accountability. I believe these exercises do help to foster greater teamwork and a sense of ownership (of the business).

I would assume from the fact that you run your own business, surely in the early stages you would have to take on multiple roles / responsibilities?

Customer service & tech support departments often suffer from broken communication and lack of resources. I'd rather resources be devoted to improving communication and documentation between customer service and other departments. It's kind of a novelty to have people who shouldn't be on the phones or who don't want to be on the phones taking customer calls. Perhaps you'll get lip service that things will change, but those promises fade as quickly they are off the phones.

Customer service is often seen as a burden/cost, and the employees expendable. Unless the company thinks differently, then you'll have issues.

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