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Show HN: Improving WhatsApp

maximiliankiener.com

54 pointsmaxkiener45 comments

What I really want is a desktop version of WhatsApp. I have a lot of conversations on there and typing on a piece of glass is just never as efficient as typing on a laptop. I haven't been able to find a desktop client that isn't blatantly laden with spam or viruses. I might take a stab at building one myself. I'd be curious if anyone has already reverse-engineered their backend API.

This is the main reason me and my friends use Telegram. It has a web client.

There is already an instant chat solution with both desktop and mobile clients: Skype. Whatsapp is useless to me, and, I suspect, most people in the US. Out of ~1200 contacts in my phone, 11 are currently registered with Whatsapp. I suspect a desktop client would be useful in Europe, India, etc. but be prepared to spend some real money on internationalization.

WhatsApp is not useless, it's pretty freaking huge.

One year ago WhatsApp had 400 million active users.

Skype has 663 million registered users, out of which 280 million are active monthly users.

I didn't say it was useless to everyone. I just said that it's pretty clear that it has a relatively small US footprint, and language fragmentation in Europe - where Whatsapp is pervasive and useful - is a significant issue. Thus writing a desktop client isn't as simple as it would appear to be at first glance.

I have a lot of international friends.

my guess would be that every whatsapp account is associated with only one phone number, and you might have to introduce a separate layer of identification.

personally, i like having one reliable messenger on one device.

that's why I use Viber when I can - it has a desktop app as well as free calling - and whatsapp when I must.

FYI: double checkmarks means your message was successfully delivered to their phone [0], not that they necessarily read your message.

https://www.whatsapp.com/faq/en/general/20951546

I was just about to comment this. Seems it's a pretty common misunderstanding.

AFAIK the only way to know if someone's read your message is to assume based on their last time online.

WHAT?! I was using it for over 2 years under that assumption! Thanks

I think it works like this on the iPhone. Probably because the msg can't be delivered unless you start the app.

Funny enough, Telegram (the open replacement for WhatsApp) works in the way you had expected (double check is read confirmation).

I always assumed that the first checkmark indicates "delivered" and the second one "read", since right after you post it it shows a clock-symbol. also interesting, that i assume with current network speeds sent=delivered.

First checkmark confirms it hit store and forward servers. I prefer second checkmark to indicate delivery, as I care less if someone read it and more if it just made it to their device.

User you are sending to could be underground/out of signal range/have 3G disabled. I like having a separate delivered confirmation and I would prefer not to have people see what I have read.

How about the first checkmark indicates delivery and the second "read". do you guys care about the "it left the phone" state?

Personally "It left the phone" state is very important to me, esp., when I am travelling and network connectivity is intermittent.

Also "Message Read" is a very ambiguous state according to me - If the content of a message is read from the notification drop down, but user never opened whatsapp to read it - is it read, or not ?

Definitely. You want confirmation it got to someplace same until delivered to the recipient. 1 check for got to server, 1 check for delivered to recipient device, and then "Read" underneath the furthest part of the conversation that has been read. Or I'm just crazy and niche.

I'd say: clock symbol till it left the phone, one checkmark for delivered, another one for read.

Perfect!

Looks like I am in the minority but I don't like the drag to share action. You would need to long press the message as you need to do right now in the current app. Pressing the forward button and then tapping on the person/group's name (the current implementation) is much easier to me. Specially with the ever increasing size of phones. I would be always worried about dropping the photo/message on the wrong group/person's bucket.

As others have pointed out, the double check is not read confirmation but is delivery confirmation. I like the way FB messenger does it right now instead of the colors that you have. I don't think it would scale very well. The average size of the groups that I am part of on WhatsApp right now is about 10.

Notes/bookmark feature is fine but I don't know how much would I use it until I start using it.

What I learned from this is a great way to prototype/demo and share an idea before building the whole app. The three improvements you suggest - 1) re-sharing in groups 2) read confirmation in groups and 3) saving - aren't the pain points that I have.

Personally, my pain is just p2p sharing with a person sitting in front (or next to me) - I want the app to understand (say, when both users press a button - its like scanning for a nearby bluetooth connection) to add a person on my whatsapp, allow me send stuff (pics), share a contact, or share a meeting invite - stuff like that. WhatsApp would be great to do this. Proximity-based p2p connections should be quite easy, and apps could make it "feel" more automatic/magical.

thanks for the feedback, i'm glad you got something out of it. i think proximity in IM-apps are a really interesting topic.

Google Hangouts does read messages really well in groups. There are little portraits showing how far someone has read.

true. I like the ideas behind hangouts (and they have the best emoji). but it is just so painfully slow and unreliable with notifications for me...

Honest question: Can I use the "last seen" time as a rough proxy for "they have read your message"? I've been wondering this for a while.

At least on Android, my 'last seen' counter doesn't update until WhatApp is brought to the foreground on my chat partner's phone, which is normally a good sign that they have read my message. If they just see the notification but don't open the app my 'last seen' counter does not update

the current implementation leaves room for speculation. especially, since others have pointed out, two checkmarks only show that it has been delivered.

the "last online" time means (AFAIK) the last time the user was using the app (could also be in a different chat).

What is it about WhatsApp that made so many people adapt it over all the alternatives, I cannot understand it.

Device support. WhatsApp works on Nokia's dumb phones, which is what everyone has in Europe/Asia if they don't have a smartphone: http://www.whatsapp.com/faq/en/general/20951556

IMO, simplicity, speed and reliability.

Why are empty circles even necessary for the read status of a message? If the colors and names are known at the top, then you only need to show which ones have read the message as filled circles and those who haven't will be known as the difference.

the thinking was that an empty circle shows the message has been delivered. once it is filled, it is read.

Just a simple acknowledgement, your name resembles with Maximilian Kohler (from Dan Brown's novel, Angels and Demons). I was shocked for a moment! :D

[Edit: fixed stupidity]

I'll take it.

Nice ideas! I wonder how the read circles scale. How do you imagine this looking for groups of 10 or 20 or more people?

thank you! i imagined it to be similiar to fb messenger. (there would be a symbol that inicates "all others" if the groups size exceeds 6.

I also expeimented with more checkmarks, or colored lines that come down and show read progress for individuals (like a race).

there would also be more information when you click the status bar of the chat.

I want that re-share feature in every messaging app!

Chris Velasco said the exact same thing! https://twitter.com/chrisvelazco/status/524987169463894017 Thanks!

Great ideas. How did you prototype/demo them?

Thanks! I built it as a .js webapp, added to the iphone homescreen. Check out the source-code in the browser dev-tools!

Crisp video! Did you make it yourself?

Danke! It took several attempts but i hope it brings the ideas across.

Can't wait. Whatsapp 2.0

Danke!

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