Apple Accidentally reveals iPad Air 2 and iPad Mini 3 | Hacker News Reader

Apple Accidentally reveals iPad Air 2 and iPad Mini 3

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132 pointssc90115 comments

At first I thought this was an 'accidental' leak. As in, a response to steal Google's thunder.

Then it hit me, and it will become immediately clear to anyone who's ever pushed an app to the App Store, this highlights their broken process for pushing apps to the store. Who ever was in charge of submitting this particular app probably didn't click the right button and just had it set to release upon approval.

Hilarious.

a response to steal Google's thunder

Probably not, as I believe it was the other way around.

What do you mean? It has been known for days that the new Nexus units would be announced today.

Perhaps that Google's Nexus release itself was timed to steal Apple's thunder (the date of which has also been known well in advance)? I'm sure something like this is the case, though we can, of course, speculate all day long about who is trying to steal whose thunder.

The real explanation probably is simply that both have devices that they want to release in time for the holiday shopping season, and it does not do either of them any good to have a new, competing product on the market, dominating the media coverage. If their competitor's product is out there being talked about, they want to make sure their own product is mentioned in the same breath. Who is stealing whose "thunder" is just a subjective spin that we put on the events as observers.

Ha! The jokes on them! I'm able to pay attention to both of them at the same time. Suckers.

I guess he meant that since apple ipad devices sells many orders of magnitude more than nexus devices, Apple can't be trying to steal Nexus's thunder; if anything it should be other way around.

Personally I have no opinion one way or another. They are all after your money and we here bitching about who is good at it. I am still happy with my three year old phone, and it does pretty much everything I need.

Does it strike anyone else that Apple's product line is starting to sound complicated?

My feelings/words exactly. Too many screen sizes, too many products. Probably they need 2/2 matrix again :-)

> Too many screen sizes

Meh. They've got 2 display sizes for each product (with displays), basically: 6/6+, iPad Mini/Air, iMac 21/27, MBA 11/13 and rMBP 13/15. The iMac and MBP used to have 3 display sizes each, and at one point there were 5 different iPod models sold at the same time (Shuffle 2G, Shuffle 3G, Nano 4G, Classic 6G and Touch 2G)

Leftover products (non-retina iPad mini, non-air retina iPad, MBP13, 5C and 5S) are a bigger annoyance I'd say.

The problem for Apple is that they sometimes want to move fast and change things, but that necessitates leaving people behind. Their preferred solution during the last decade or so is to mostly keep the old products around for a while, but deemphasise them in their marketing.

I do think that’s the right approach, actually.

Starting to get sloppy.

It's been a long time coming. I mean, do we even know whether 5S or 5C refer to anything in particular?

What's really weird that they don't have an iPad Pro in that lineup, because that was what we assumed to be the reason they went with the name "iPad Air".

Yes, the S model is a faster (_S_peedier) version of the previous model. 3GS, 4S, 5S. The C means it's the _C_olored variant.

(and/or "cheap")

Not to me. Just to list the current models:

Tablets: iPad Mini 3, iPad Air 2.

Phones: iPhone 6, iPhone 6+.

Desktops: Mac Mini, iMac, Mac Pro.

Portables: Macbook Air, Macbook Pro.

You can even make that list ordered by size from memory like I did, and I'm not an Apple guy although I have a Mini that runs windows, and an iPad Air).

Your listing is simplified compared to the actual lineup

* The non-air iPad Retina and non-retina Mini are still part of the lineup

* the 5S and 5C are still part of the lineup

* the iMac exists in 21 and 27"

* the rMBP exists in 13 and 15"

* the MBA exists in 11 and 13"

* the 13" MBP still exists

He said "current" models, not all existing models. I understood current as "latest."

Current is most definitely != latest. Current means any model that is still in production and being sold, although admittedly for some manufacturers those two things don't usually align, Apple has a tendency to remove models immediately from the line up when they cease production.

While that is true, you clearly understood I was talking about the line of latest products. Even when you look at others, all you add is the older Mini, older iPad, and a few variations on the portables and desktops. It's still a very small suite of products compared to any other comparable manufacturer. It's pretty much one item in each category, with in0line variations on size/capacity.

1. these are all current models, they're currently produced and sold on the store. In fact the list is still incomplete since it's missing 3 different iPods (Touch, Nano and Shuffle)

2. Even if you understand "current" as "latest" (which is most definitely a non-standard definition) that removes the old MBP, the 5's and the leftover ipads, the ipods and various screen sizes of macs remain.

Yes, they sell a generation of older products, non retina iPad and mini, as well as the 5C and S. That makes a total of 4 iPads and 4 phones, not counting storage/color variations. a 21 and 27 inch iMac are still both iMacs, and that's just a size variant, not a whole different product. Same for the MBA and MBP, those are simply size/feature differences, not entirely different products. Would you also then break out each and every storage/ram/cpu combination on the MBA and MBP lines? I doubt it. It's still a fraction of what other makers produce.

> a 21 and 27 inch iMac are still both iMacs

The 6 and 6+ are still both iPhone 6s, the only difference beside size is extremely minor (optical stabilization), not entirely different products.

> Same for the MBA and MBP, those are simply size/feature differences, not entirely different products.

See above.

> Would you also then break out each and every storage/ram/cpu combination on the MBA and MBP lines? I doubt it. It's still a fraction of what other makers produce.

That's swapping out parts obtained from third parties (hence BTO), different display sizes lead to difference in effective uses, and require very different internal chassis.

"I have a Mini that runs windows"

Dang. We can't be friends.

It dual boots, but I do most stuff in Windows or in a terminal to a few linux boxes.

I was just trolling. We're cool.

Yes, and recall that this was one of the key problems that Jobs fixed when he came back.

Bigger iPad=Air, but smaller Macbook=Air. Bigger Macbook=Pro, but bigger iPhone=Plus.

When the iWatch comes out, it'll get worse.

Actually, it's just called the Watch.

(Case and point)

Sure, what about the second version (coming , I guess, in about 7 months? ) Watch 2 ?

Watch Air.

To be even more pedantic: ᴡᴀᴛᴄʜ

He's right, in all the branding in all the promotional materials that I've seen, they use 0xF8FF.

I looked it up, 0xF8FF () is the Apple symbol. If it renders as a square/rectangular box on your computer, it's because it's trademarked and a logo, which means you need an Apple font to render it. (Which I/you don't have, because Apple fonts only come with Apple computers.)

Just responding because I saw this comment was downvoted.

actually, 0xF8FF is in a unicode private use area.

Font designers can put whatever they want there, and some do (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_Use_Areas#U.2BF8FF)

Apple has standardized some characters in that range in its products, but there is no guarantee that you get an Apple logo there.

And if you're using some common Linux fonts (I'm pretty sure it's dejavu, in this case) that character renders as the Klingon Empire logo.

0xF8FF is in the Unicode Private Use range, so any font is allowed to put whatever they want there :) (If you're curious what your current font has: http://www.unicodemap.org/range/78/Private_Use/)

Air doesn't mean bigger/smaller, it means lighter.

Expect an iPad Pro soon, probably heavier but with much more capability.

> Yes, and recall that this was one of the key problems that Jobs fixed when he came back.

What we have now is not comparable. Check out the timeline here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Apple_Macintosh_mo...

Take a look at 1995 where there were at least 18 different Mac models simultaneously available. They all had different marketing part numbers and to add the confusion, some were actually the same machine under 3 different brandings[1]. The graph doesn't show the different brandings, so the lineup was actually much more complicated than it looks.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadra_630

You mean like the iPod Classic, Mini, Nano, Shuffle, Touch?

The iPad has had such a weird naming convention:

- iPad

- iPad 2

- The new iPad

- I don't even know what the 4th gen was called.

- iPad Air

- iPad Air 2

I was hoping for 4 speakers (one at each corner) for stereo sound in both orientations.

Plus it's quite ugly that the new iPads, of the same generation, have different numbers (iPad Air 2, iPad Mini 3)

Not really.

4th gen was iPad with Retina Display.

Edit: to everybody responding that the 3rd gen ("The new iPad") had a retina display, I was pointing out the marketing name for the 4th gen.

3rd gen was the first Retina iPad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPad

Retina came in the 3rd generation.

the 3rd gen got Retina. the 4th gen was only to include the lightening connector.

The 3rd-gen iPad had a retina display, but the marketing name for the 4th-gen iPad is "iPad with Retina Display". Yes, when the 4th-gen iPad was released, "The new iPad" (the 3rd-gen iPad) was no longer the new iPad, and "iPad with Retina Display" wasn't the first iPad with a retina display.

It was also a significant SoC upgrade, from A5X to A6X. The iPad 4th gen could handle the Retina display much more smoothly.

The fact that I need to remember that and tell my friends to watch out for that pitfall when they order their "new" iPad is just frustrating.

What do you mean? There are no pitfalls when buying a new iPad.

I know and it's silly. The 3rd generation was marketed as "The new iPad", and got the retina screen.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPad_(3rd_generation)

The 4th generation is marked as "iPad with Retina display" even though it was not the first with the retina display.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPad_(4th_generation)

I suppose the original comment was about the crazy marketing, not the features.

Damn, I was hoping they would finally improve the speaker positioning as well. "Stereo" speakers right next to each other on the bottom is so pointless.

The speakers are in the right position. Your obviously holding it wrong.

I'm not sure that I agree that they have too many products or the names have gotten confusing. You can still fit all their products on a single desk. A company of that size, with that kind of revenue, and so few product offerings is nuts.

Also, this "leak", how is it different from other leaks in the past? There were leaks all around the iPhone 4. I don't think leaks matter too much to the average consumer. When Apple does a product announcement, I tell my folks about it. 9 times out of 10 they had no idea.

Hiccups happened in Jobs' keynotes all the time. More options isn't a bad thing. The mobile market is maturing. No big deal.

How little actual information is contained in this "leak".

"The Air 2 and Mini 3 exist. With TouchID. They remain physically unchanged."

Direct link to the image on one of their CDNs: http://a4.mzstatic.com/us/r30/Publication3/v4/2c/22/0d/2c220...

Direct HD link: https://s4.mzstatic.com/us/r30/Publication3/v4/2c/22/0d/2c22...

Big deal. These "specs" are all-but-obvious. Everyone knows the new iPads will have TouchID.

Another black rectangular tablet. Slightly different form factor. What's the big deal?

Steve Jobs Apple era is gone for good:

- leaks

- more options, more complicated lineup (iPhone 5C/5S, 6, 6+, iPad too)

- competing with Android instead of differentiating (larger phones, customization)

- hiccups during keynote

Not necessary a bad thing, but something is gone and it's unlikely to return soon. Probably Apple will benefit in short term, but long term doesn't look so clear.

> leaks

I always had a love/hate relationship with the "one more thing" approach. When Apple has a real blockbuster product to reveal, it was a lot of fun. But sometimes it was a big letdown. I remember when they introduced the v1 Apple TV. It felt half-baked.

I think Apple has done a better job managing expectations going into new product releases. I haven't feel the same "let down" feeling in a while.

(Not saying this particular leak was intentional, just an observation)

Let us reclaim the timeline from Apple and stop caring about their leaks. The cloak and dagger routine seems laughably archaic to me, and they've only been doing it for a few years now.

Go study up on the Osborne effect for an understanding of why Apple goes for secrecy on new products.

What are the hiccups during the keynote? Do you just mean the technical issues with the live stream?

I was more worried about Apple's long term future under Jobs. It seemed like he bet the farm on everything Apple released, and noone is good enough to win every time.

The complicated lineup is probably more related to a maturing market

laptop is a matured market and the lineup under Jobs was very straight forward (Macbook, macbook pro, macbook air).

EDIT: Since all the reply to my comment seem to complety miss my point, here it is:

Apple's laptop lineup is very straight forward compared to their competitor in regards to LAPTOP. Have a look at HP, Dell, Acer, Lenovo's[1] offering. They have like 30 different laptops.

[1] http://shop.lenovo.com/ca/en/laptops

Laptops are more modular than the newer phones. So most laptop manufacturers give you options to 'customize' the specs. It is probably not profitable to have fully customizable phones, yet. So you have 'more models'. In my opinion, people make this a bigger deal than it actually is. The equivalent of 15" Macbook Pro is perhaps the iPhone Plus, which people criticize as 'more models', etc.

A straightforward laptop line that had more size options than are available for either iPhones or iPads. I think they had six sizes at once going for a while? Two airs, three MBPs, one MB?

How about you compare the laptop lineup with its own industry?

So it's still very straightforward under Cook, too: MBA, MBPR, and MBP which probably hasn't much time left.

It signals to me that revenue has more perceived value than profit. I agree with this philosophy if the company uses the forgone profits to pursue risky but potentially rewarding ideas similar to the way Amazon has. I don't agree with it when the "idea" is a device with features they withheld from a previous release in an overcrowded category that they already dominate. That is not to say I don't like the idea of a cheaper iphone -- cheaper iphones can be a great gateway drug to the apple ecosystem. Its the 6+ or 5s that Im talking about. I expect a lot more from a company with $160 billion on hand and with the reputation of Apple's.

> hiccups during keynote

Pretty sure Jobs had a few hiccups of his own: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzDDO3Xb_QU

> more options, more complicated lineup (iPhone 5C/5S, 6, 6+, iPad too)

You forgot the watch. :p

It seems like too big of a coincidence that this purported "leak" happened on the same day as the new Nexus line announcements.

Steve Jobs didn't pass away until the iPhone 4S' release. The iPhone 4 was leaked by being left in a bar the previous year. I wouldn't say leaks are any more or less an issue now than they were with him still at the helm.

Let's stop pretending that there were never any leaks on Steve's watch because it dovetails with our conclusions. Think Secret and Macrumors didn't just open up shop under Tim Cook.

edit: And let's stop pretending a lot of options in a key product is a revolution. Steve shipped the iPod Classic, Nano, Shuffle and Touch at the same time.

edit2: and let's stop pretending there were never any keynote hiccups under Steve "can everyone turn off their wifi?" Jobs

True. When Steve Jobs died the Steve Jobs era ended. Your pointless comments cause my eyes to bleed. Maybe someday you'll get to run a company worth several hundred billion dollars. But until then, let's try not run someone else's from Hacker News.

It is gone for good, because Jobs passed away and won't be reincarnated. So can we please give these "Steve is gone" comments on every Apple post on HN?

It's doubtful that this was unintentionally released hours after Google makes new announcements about its Nexus devices. A classic 'steal-the-thunder' move.

I think Google still ends up getting more press, since their releases are more interesting, but it's not a bad play by Apple.

Well they have an event tomorrow anyway

Google made their announcement the day before the Apple event strategically.

Apple 'leaked' this new info to try to steal some of the attention from Google, and get people talking about what else they will reveal at the event tomorrow, thus shifting the conversation back to Apple.

None of this happens accidentally. It's all very well-timed and follows the classic playbook for "crashing" your competitor's news.

If the Nexus devices were available for pre-order today, I would be inclined to agree with you. However, since they aren't available for pre-order until the 17th, the day after the Apple announcement, then I doubt Apple is worried. Apple knows full well that they will dominate the new tomorrow.

Does everyone kvetching about Apple's product line realize that they have many different product lines? And that there are only 2 iPads (which only people on HN refer to with a generation number, Apple just calls them the iPad Mini and iPad Air).

Steve jobs came back and simplified their desktop and laptop lineup from each having like 10 models to each having 2 or 3 clearly defined models. As they add phones, tablets and watches should each have only 1 model so that the absolute number of models in all of Apple's businesses stay constant?

Is this Apple's attempt to steal the spotlight away from today's Android & Nexus launches?

If the new Nexus devices were available for pre-order today: maybe. Since the Nexus devices are not available for pre-order until the day after the iPad announcement: unlikely.

I don't see why the preorder date would matter so much. I would think that this would be much more about manipulating the tech press to divert resources that would have been used to cover the Nexus announcements to, instead, cover the leak. If this was intentional, it would be about "mindshare," not about merely staving off a few preorders. (There are probably also not a lot of people preordering Nexus devices who would be so easily nudged into buying an iPad.)

i thought the ipad mini 3 was called iphone 6 plus

That would be an iPad Mini Air

The iOS showing is also 8.1.

They've already released 8.1 beta 2 to developers. Apple's been waiting to release it publicly after Yosemite is released.

Based on the rumors that Apple Pay is coming this weekend, I think 8.1 is likely to be released tomorrow or Friday.

An hour after Google announced its stuff. Sure. Just a coincidence.

I feel like it's almost never a coincidence with 'leaks' from tech firms.

I honestly don't think Apple ever does something accidentally related to marketing. Everything is planned and executed to perfection. You can say a lot about Apple, but they're very good at marketing and "accidentally" stealing attention (remember that guy "leaving" his unreleased iPhone in a bar?).

You are giving them way too much credit.

The first screenshot "accidentally" shows the specs of their new devices.

Apple messing up on tech? Yep. Apple messing up on marketing? Much less likely. This leak is about as accidental as me.

> This leak is about as accidental as me.

That doesn't say much, does it? I don't know you, were you accidental? :-)

> Apple messing up on marketing? Much less likely.

U2 album.

Like the firmware update (iOS 8.0.1) that completely disabled cellular and the touchid reader on iPhone 6?

Looks like QA is slipping heavily these days.

Granted, that was not good, but I did mean marketing-related accidents only.

Jobs told on stage that FaceTime was going to be an open standard, and anyone could connect to it. Granted, WWDC is a developer conference but a WWDC keynote is still very much a marketing event.

This is the same company that recently released an iOS update that broke touchID (and WiFi?) for their brand new phones. Humans aren't perfect.

As much as a portion of my mind wants to think this leak was a well timed attempt to draw tablet news in their direction mere hours after Google released information about theirs, I honestly believe it was just a mistake. Apple gains nothing by releasing this information a mere 24 hours before their big announcement. This is just a mistimed button click.

> (remember that guy "leaving" his unreleased iPhone in a bar?)

Yes, remember how hard they went after Gizmodo because of it?

Confirmed by TC: http://techcrunch.com/2014/10/15/apple-leaks-the-ipad-air-2-...

When are they going to update their laptops? Air?

They generally update Mac hardware in the spring.

No, that’s not true. Well, spring might be true this time around, but it’s not typically spring.

They have been in lockstep with Intel ever since the switch to Intel. Look at Intels roadmap and you will know when there will be new Macs. It’s as simple as that.

(Of course, this only applies to their best selling Macs, specifically all their mobile Macs. Others may be a bit more neglected and updated less frequently or only six months after Intel comes out with their new CPUs.)

True, I was going more or less on personal recollection, and it when I've bought new machines. That said, I've had horrible luck, and I tell people that if they want to know if Apple is about to announce new MacBooks, ask me if I've bought one in the last couple of weeks :-)

I believe it is rumored that they'll announce new iMacs (and by extension, I'm hoping for a new Thunderbolt display). According to BGR, supposedly they'll announce a 12" MacBook Air Retina

I believe they're waiting on Broadwell.

[MacRumors](http://www.macrumors.com/roundup/macbook-air/) says new airs MAYBE 'near the end of the year' but looking at the [buyer's guide](http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/#MacBook_Air) it's not even as old as the Air model that was replaced the earliest in its lifespan; I wouldn't plan for anything before spring 2015.

When Intel releases their next gen processors (2015).

In a gripping development, an accidental release indicates that the two devices will look... pretty much identical to the current versions. But they'll have a HIGHER NUMBER at the end, so this is HOT NOOZE! (facepalm)

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