Comment by chrisweekly | Hacker News Reader

Comment by chrisweekly | Hacker News Reader

PSA: for contemporary, entertaining, thought-provoking novels relating to sci-fi, my short list of must-reads includes these gems:

* The Gone-Away World (Harkaway) [1]

* Ready Player One (Cline) [2] and

* The Martian (Weir) [3]

each of which is impossible to put down. Actually Harkaway's entire oevre is terrific. The steampunk Angelmaker [4] was a ton of fun.

Also, many of Iain M Banks' Culture novels (The Player of Games [5] is at the top of my personal list; they can be read in any order) and The Wind-up Girl (Bacigalupi) [6] are must-reads too.

This is not meant as criticism of the OP, rather as fodder for commenters referencing other longer and more contemporary lists.

Oh and a final, related tangent: if, like me, you really enjoy G.R.R. Martin but generally avoid straight-up fantasy [it seems to me the genre is awash in mediocre Tolkien rip-offs] please give The Name of the Wind (Rothfuss) [7] a chance. You'll be glad you did. :)

[1] http://smile.amazon.com/Gone-Away-World-Nick-Harkaway-ebook/...

[2] http://smile.amazon.com/Ready-Player-One-Ernest-Cline-ebook/...

[3] http://smile.amazon.com/Martian-Novel-Andy-Weir-ebook/dp/B00...

[4] http://smile.amazon.com/Angelmaker-Nick-Harkaway-ebook/dp/B0...

[5] http://smile.amazon.com/Player-Games-Culture-Novel-Book-eboo...

[6] http://smile.amazon.com/Windup-Girl-Paolo-Bacigalupi-ebook/d...

[7] http://smile.amazon.com/Name-Wind-Kingkiller-Chronicle-Day-e...

The Name of the Wind really is good. The second book of the series (The Wise Man's Fear) is also excellent.

Actually, just reading through the list, I was a little disappointed. Yes, there are some great classics, but Timeline" by Michael Crichton as the "time travel" sci-fi novel of reference. No, just no.

For time travel based sci-fi, Timescape by Gregory Benford is my pick of the lot. Bedford is actually an astrophysicist, so his version of time travel actually make sense. Plus, the characters in the books are scientists. It's a very thought provoking book. He has a second book along those lines, Cosm, which I loved as well, for it's portrayal of the lives of scientists.

Definitely good stuff. In terms of Orc-free pseudo-fantasy stuff, for those that liked Rothfuss and somewhat weird stuff (i.e. Ready Player One - though writing wasn't as good in that IMHO), Lev Grossman's Magicians series is possibly worth checking out. Anyway, I really liked it.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Magicians-Novel-Trilogy/dp/0670020...

I really loved Name of the Wind, but actually felt a little let down by Wise Man's Fear. Dunno whether I was just expecting too much after an excellent first book, but I thought it should have been sub-titled "Kvothe gets laid and the plot goes nowhere".

I can agree with the sentiment that the plot didn't go very far, but I think that's okay, since the world opened up so much in the second book.

Yeah that's true. I definitely enjoyed the book, I guess it's the old "I want more now" feeling coming into play. Which is usually a very good sign for any sort of entertainment, always leave them wanting more!

I've read the first book, and then decided to avoid the rest of the series. It was a boring life story of a flawless character who becomes a master in anything he partakes in, from acting to thievery to magic, and all before his teenage years... Totally ridiculous, in my opinion.

I had a similar reaction to "Assassin's Apprentice" by Robin Hobb; although not as perfect as Kvothe, her Fitz has all the possible talents in one place, from the Wit to the Skill etc. On the other hand, Hobb's Liveship Traders amazed me with the complexity of the story, as well as the beautifully designed characters (nearly none was a two-dimensional caricature but a real human being with feelings and motivations) -- it was like the reading a completely different author.

> It was a boring life story of a flawless character who becomes a master in anything he partakes in, from acting to thievery to magic, and all before his teenage years... Totally ridiculous, in my opinion.

The point is made many times that he is an unreliable narrator, and that this is a self-mythologising, which is part of why I like it.

With Assassin's Apprentice Fitz has all the possible talents in one place but seriously lacks in intelligence and in making rational choices. I spent all her books wishing I could slap Fitz until I just couldn't take it anymore.

I will have to try Liveship traders

Whilst I agree in some parts, the main character being exceptional is kinda the entire point of a heroic fantasy novel.

They are exceptional by design. If they weren't amazing swordsmen, or magic users, or highly intelligent, or highly determined, they'd be dying at the first hurdle in the story - which is equally ridiculous for a novel. The alternative for underpowered fantasy characters is either a non-perilous story or a lot of "deus ex machina" moments where the character survives by "random" chance. Neither of which are particularly interesting.

Narrative imperative does have some demands on story characters, but it's all down to the quality of the writing as to whether you can suspend your disbelief.

Well, being "exceptional" is one thing, but being flawless is something completely different. I agree that the best characters are exceptional, but flawless characters are difficult to take seriously, and tend to be quite boring.

Take Frodo Baggins, Thomas Covenant, Malta Vestrit, Jon Snow, Miles Vorkosigan, Sherlock Holmes or any of the countless prominent characters from fiction of any genre -- they are all quite exceptional, but also significantly flawed in one or many ways. I didn't see any prominent flaws in Kvothe, which made him really boring and uninteresting; now, as someone else mentioned, he is an unreliable narrator of his own life story, and it is quite possible that in later books it will turn out that a lot if it was a lie and his flaws will be revealed, but by then I have long lost my interest and I don't think I'll ever get that far. I do enjoy a good twist in the story, but the story up to that point needs to be interesting on its own; Usual Suspects wouldn't work at all if Verbal Kint was a flawless character.

I would think that Kvothe is every bit as flawed as Miles Vorkosigan. They both end up in sticky situations because they're more than just a little arrogant, which results in them biting off more than they can chew. Kvothe is not the best swordsman, he get's beaten up by a little girl. He is not the best Sympathist, again he get's beaten up when he thinks he is.

I just noticed though, as I'm writing this reply, that most of these flaws come out in the second book, not the first. Maybe you need to stick with the series a bit more before making up your mind.

Yeah, I think for me Kvothe's flawlessness was balanced by the unreliable narrator, who demonstrated that Kvothe in the present/future is not all-powerful anymore (if he ever was). The premise of the book thus appearing to be an inversion of the standard "weak hero becomes strong hero" plot, instead intriguing you from the start with wondering how a strong hero becomes so decrepit.

That's why I found it quite frustrating reading the 2nd book, as the present/future feels like where the "real" story lies, but it made absolutely no advancement in that direction. So I definitely agree with you there, the focus on the super-powered young Kvothe does detract from the main story as I see it.

I'd say that the series as a whole is just ok. I did enjoy both books, but they didn't stick out in my mind as amazing.

Another great time travel novel is Replay by Ken Grimwood. One of the few books I've read twice.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Replay_%28Grimwood_novel%29

I absolutely hated the Windup Girl fwiw. The science made no sense whatsoever & and the successive "lets rape the sex-bot again!" scenes made me question why I was reading the book at all. About the only thing is had going for it was atmosphere & once you peel back that surface there's nothing there that would ever make me want to read that book again.

I love that book. I have the audio version, and the narrator is excellent, so that lends to relistening easily.

The world it presents is very deep. It mixes a near future of more advanced technologies in some aspects with what a post-cheap energy future could be like.

Ready Player One was awesome. Highly recommend the Wil Wheaton audio book!

Yeah, I've heard that audiobook was great. I had a period of lengthy commuting when I listed to a ton of audiobooks, and found that Banks' Culture novels -- narrated by Peter Kenny in paricular -- were excellent. Kenny's performances really brought the works to life. A bad narrator can kill a good audiobook, and even a terrific one can't salvage a bad read. But pair an outstanding author with first-rate narration, and it's transformative. Highly recommended! :)

It's interesting how opinions about Ready Player One can be so polarized. As someone who spent their formative years living through the 80s, this book was a non-stop cringe-fest of embarrassment for me, made even worse by Wil Wheaton's over-the-top voice acting.

While I did quite enjoy the author's vision of futuristic VR, all the 80s camp and nostalgia ruined it for me.

I wanted to like it but couldn't get past the first couple of chapters. The reason? It's just so poorly written; the author never shows when he can just tell. It reads more like a description of a novel than an actual novel.

I finally got around to reading it. It was mildly enjoyable in the way decent fast food can be enjoyable, but I don't understand how people can claim this immature one dimensional story and okay writing constitutes a great book.

I enjoyed it because I'm a nerd who grew up in the 80's, but it's bubblegum entertainment with the depth of puddle.

I love SF, but the lack of distinction (by both fans and critics) between entertaining stories and good literature kinda turns me off and stops me from reading more. I constantly get disappointed when some highly praised SF book turns out to be nothing more than nerd equivalent of chick-lit.

Fuck, I even love SyFy channel's B-movie crap every once in a while, but at least I don't get duped into watching it thinking it is great cinema.

I would probably have enjoyed the book more if I had more realistic expectations.

I share your sentiments, in re expectations. Agreed RPO is a beach read, nostalgic fun for this child of the 80s, vs serious literature. Harkaway OTOH is a terrific writer and thinker per se, IMHO.

I found the second book of Name of the Wind really badly written and juvenile sex fantasy. Let me recommend the Stormlight Archive instead, fantastically written and imaginative world: http://brandonsanderson.com/books/the-stormlight-archive/

Our taste in novels seems to be really similar. For that reason, I'm reading the ones on your list I have not read.

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