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BugBrother

>>illegally crossing a border will get you detained or fired at in almost any place now and ever,

Leaving a border will generally not make soldiers shoot at you from the country you leave.

Being that locked in only happens to slaves and other prisoners.

And I think you know that.

>>Regarding renowned Wikipedia researchers

(I already noted that you learn differently in your schools, like most all other countries with recent atrocities in their history.)

Sorry, if you argue against wikipedia without even looking at research references I can't take you seriously.

I didn't read the rest.

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>> Leaving a border will generally not make soldiers shoot at you from the country you leave. Is it really so? Which countries can be left safely this way, in view of the border patrols? :)

>> I didn't read the rest. Arguing through not listening may indeed be an effective (albeit a solipsistic) strategy, but not in a public discussion :)

"Your schools covering up recent atrocities!", and Russian leaders historically outperforming the West in enslaving nations -- is that really what you've been taught?

Again, what cover up are we talking of? You very much cannot sell a 60 M dead from famine story to anyone here, due to presence of alive witnesses -- but it obviously flies much better over the curtain and far away. What is taught builds on information declassified during the 90-ies, when "dozens of millions dead" claim was fashionable, but found no supporting ground, to quite a surprise of those insisting on access to relevant documents and their publication.

>> Which countries can be left safely this way, in view of the border patrols? :)

You knowingly misrepresent my point. That is the only argument you have left. Sad.:-(

People couldn't leave East Europe freely, unlike the democratic world. (Hell, Romania charged Germany/Israel to let German speaking and Jewish Romanians leave.) And if they tried anyway, they were shot down.

Again -- I stopped reading after the first paragraph. If you hand wave at references with links to real research, you're just not serious.

Well, in all seriousness, I cannot see what was misinterpreted; may be not reading after the first paragraph could shed some light? Your real research smells hoax, and one obviously needs to be on the other side of the ocean to not notice that. Continue not reading :)

>>Your real research smells hoax

Discuss that on the wikipedia page, by presenting other research.

Oh wait, you don't know any.

Bye.

Farewell discovering more shocking (but well-researched) truth on Wikipedia, keep up the good job believing in a cover-up of 50 M deaths from a 200 M population :)

Yet another misrepresentation of what I wrote.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8372340

Original link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_killings_under_Communist_r...

Subtract 8 from 61 (best combined with trying to force yourself to read what you claim to not have had read above).

Good luck promoting your very own criteria for people being "slaves in a prison country", may be one day the meaning of terms will change enough for your original post (the one on the nations "enslaved" by Russian Leaders) to make sense :)

As you know: In my references, most researchers seems to be between 15-20 millions.

My definition of slave:

Someone living with no rule of law. No human rights. E.g. their property and lives can be taken on a whim by their rulers. They are not allowed to leave, or there are violent repercussions.

A typical communist state. And slavery.

What is unique with those criteria?

Ok, so we are down from the sensational 60+ M figures to 3-4 times less now, that's progress (still questionable figures though) :)

A "typical" communist state from 50 years may not give its people what a pedantic contemporary person would call a full set of "human rights", but would provide free education, medicine, and so on (not to mention lesser level of violent crimes often), how's that slavery?

[as regarding not being able to leave -- you can make an attempt and force yourself to read above on that -- difference in income equalities, forming a nice "brain drain potential" is a pragmatic reason to constrain emigration, not some mysterious appetite of "party leader" for eating their own people alive]

You know absolutely nothing about communism, so to say :)

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