Yao Ming aims to save Africa's elephants by persuading China to give up ivory | Hacker News Reader

Yao Ming aims to save Africa's elephants by persuading China to give up ivory

washingtonpost.com

174 pointsadamnemecek38 comments

You guys should consider donating to the International Anti-Poaching Foundation[0][1] which fights these poachers. The founder, Damien Mander[2], is an Australian ex spec-ops sniper who is using his military experience to train the park rangers since they, unlike the poachers, tend to be poorly equipped and trained as well as understaffed.

There is also the David Sheldrick Wildlife Trust[3][4] which takes care of elephant and rhino orphans (most of them are orphans due to poaching). For $50 a year, you can become a sponsor of a particular animal and they'll send you photos and updates about how your sponsored animal is doing. You can for example sponsor this little fella [5][6].

[0] http://www.iapf.org/en/

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Anti-Poaching_Fou...

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damien_Mander

[3] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org

[4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Sheldrick_Wildlife_Trust

[5] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org/asp/orphan_profile.asp...

[6] http://instagram.com/p/sigT3IAUKb

We are sorry to inform you that your little fella is dead.

Where did you see that?

I was going to donate tonight when I got home ..

I'm assuming that it was a dumb joke. The orphan literally got the orphanage yesterday. You can also choose another elephant[0] or rhino[1] orphan from the list if you want to

[0] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org/asp/orphans_history.as...

[1] http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org/asp/orphans_history_rh...

I find no validation of that: http://www.sheldrickwildlifetrust.org/asp/orphan_profile.asp...

I am not sure, but I think he was joking. It is a risk which may affect donations but it might be worth it.

This documentary is about Aisha (tiny orphan elephant, who barely made it to 6 months) and Daphne Sheldrick

http://video.pbs.org/video/2365284372/

Daphne's efforts to save these amazing animals started with Aisha. It is a sad yet beautiful doc. Well worth the 50 mins or so.

I was actually just at the Sheldrick Elephant Orphanage here in Nairobi last week and was really impressed with the work that they are doing. From what I can tell, they seem to operate of some fairly thin margins, I am sure that any donations would be hugely appreciated.

For what it's worth, their option to "adopt a baby elephant" makes for a great present for a lot of people I have found.

So happy to see Yao using his influence for good. I think Chinese consumption of shark fin and ivory are more habits than desire. Habits can change through education.

I'm not sure status symbols are as simple as "habits or desire". And that's what shark fins and ivory are to the chinese, much like caviar to westerners (and with similar consequences on providing creatures).

You might be able to fix "traditional medecine" issues (which China has in droves) using education, but status symbols acquisition is not about illiteracy or lack of education. You can only fix the problem through social shaming, by reversing those status and making them status of bad taste.

The article links to another article which suggests that the popularity of shark fin soup has been falling http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/in-china-victory-for-wil... supposedly partially thanks to Yao Ming's involvement.

Another factor besides habit and status: perhaps Chinese culture is simply more accepting of animal cruelty?

"Western culture" has very similar (and extant wrt sturgeons amongst others if mostly curbed when it comes to mammals) issues, Chinese weren't the ones slaughtering charismatic megafauna for fun and status symbols in the late 19th century and early 20th century.

News flash: every culture has barbaric ghosts in its past. It's what we do here and now that matters.

News flash: "western culture" is still dynamiting endangered sturgeons (and other roe-producing species passing their roe as caviar[0])

[0] https://medium.com/full-belly-reports/every-spring-game-ward...

Don't forget rhinoceros horns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhinoceros#Horn_trade_and_use

Tiger's are another issue - a big reason for the decrease in India's tiger population is that the demand from China is so overwhelming; apparently a tiger's gonads are considered a valuable aphrodisiac. This kind of insanity has to stop before the animal is extinct.

The pangolin situation is much more dire (warning, may trigger sadness, furor and extreme misanthropy):

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/extinction-countdown/201...

http://www.popsci.com/article/science/pangolin-smuggling-sho...

http://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2014/04/opinion/sutter-ch...

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/extinction-countdown/201...

Agreed. There are people doing good work in this area, but if we've learnt one lesson, its that the economic gravity tends to win out. In the drug war (not a perfect analogy by any means), as long as US consumer demand exists, people will find a way to provide it. In China, unless you can shape the underlying demand for poached materials in some form (and be more successful than the US has been on drugs), it's going to persist, especially as that country continues to grow richer.

I agree it is insanity, if i was Yao Ming, my PSA would go as follows.

Gentlemen, before going to the extremes of using tiger balls to get your Girlfriend, Wife or Xiao San in the mood... First try these proven western approaches.

- Put on a Sade album

- Give her a glass of rose wine

- light a candle beside the bed

- Tell her she looks pretty in that dress

- Give her a new Coach handbag

- Slip some Molly in her drink right before desert

Why may you ask... Lets say there are 3200 tigers in the world (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger) 50% are likely to be male leaving 1600 male tigers * 2 balls. That leaves roughly 3200 balls - not counting ones lost in childhood slingshot accidents.

Sadly, there soon will be no more balls to use ;( and you do not want to be left with "No Game."

Was it really necessary to throw in a rape joke?

Wasn't intended to be, but i can see how it would be taken that way. If tiger's balls are as powerful as the legend has it... would it be the equivalent?

I've long thought that one of the highest impact things scientists and engineers could be working on is developing a form of ivory that is indistinguishable from real thing to collapse the market. It seems like it should be feasible.

I doubt it. Look at pearls or diamonds.

The sort of people who will pay extra for brand new ivory aren't going to bought off with fake ivory.

Fake pearls are distinguishable, and I don't know much about the state of lab-grown diamonds.

Lab grown diamonds are superior.

From 11 years ago: http://archive.wired.com/wired/archive/11.09/diamond.html

People will always figure out ways to distinguish one thing from another, if that's what they choose to do. It's not just a technical problem, it's a social one.

We have to make it clear it is not okay to regard ivory hacked from the face of an elephant as better than a synthetic polymer. To regard diamonds scrabbled over the blood of Africans as better than their synthetic equivalents. To regard the flesh of tortured chickens as better than synthetic meat replacements.

And this can be done. There is now a consensus that it's not okay to regard the fur of tortured animals as better than synthetic fabrics. Sometimes there is actually such a thing as social progress.

> We have to make it clear it is not okay to regard ivory hacked from the face of an elephant as better than a synthetic polymer.

The best thing to do would be to make natural ivory anything boorish and in bad taste.

Although there's a risk of exciting the morons: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/201...

I may be about to say something stupid, but couldn't we preemptively cut out the tusks from wild elephants so that there would be no point in poaching them?

Are tusks necessary for elephants to cut through the bush? I see elephants who don't have tusks in documentaries all the time, so I'm wondering.

And even if tusks are necessary, maybe we could replace the originals with prosthesis (of a different color) -- certainly not an easy task on a wild elephant, but worth a try maybe??

Or just somehow ruin the tusks while leaving them in place? Scratch them, turn them in a different color, something?

> I may be about to say something stupid, but couldn't we preemptively cut out the tusks from wild elephants so that there would be no point in poaching them?

De-horning programs were started for rhinos in the 90s following that idea, which theoretically held up (despite being a risk to the animal, you have to put him to sleep which may kill him, and de-horning remains traumatic). De-horned rhinos still got poached: http://www.savetherhino.org/rhino_info/issues_for_debate/de-...

There's little reason to believe elephants would fare better, sadly.

> Are tusks necessary for elephants to cut through the bush?

They're for battle (defence against predators animals as well as combats between males, in these case they also act as "bumpers" to protect the fragile trunk), and hard tasks: the trunk handles precision stuff, the tusks are used to move crap out of the way, dig for water or roots, removing bark from trees.

They're not technically necessary, although tuskless elephants are less fit.

Many thanks for this answer and link; very enlightening.

If I understand the article correctly, it seems de-horned rhinos are poached mostly because poachers don't see the rhino has lost its horns, and they kill it then because

1) they're furious when they find out

2) they don't want to waste more time hunting it again

If this is true it would probably be less of a problem for elephants as their tusks (or absence thereof) are more visible.

It still sounds like a horrible procedure, but I don't think trying to curb demand will ever be effective -- or maybe in the very long run, when there are no elephants left.

I wish Yao luck. The total ban contemplated by the USA has me worried. It's an admission of defeat. Certainly something can be done to accommodate the ivory taken legally.

It also sparks memories - for instance, what happened to the "blood diamond" campaign waged by deBeers? I presume it had some success, because the US govt hasn't seen fit to ban all diamonds? They used a certification process.

Another similar situation exists with Brazilian rosewood. Gibson ran into some trouble over that. And yet nothing has been done except to ban trade. No attempt made at sustainability or habitat preservation.

Connecting the dots...deBeers making money, no ban. deBeers not making money, ban.

Generating awareness is the first step to take in helping solve this issue (and a very difficult step at that). Good for Yao Ming!

Recently, there was a article about why Vultures get killed in Africa (it has to do with ivory also)

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/28/opinion/the-poisoning-of-a...

This could reduce desertification and reduce atmospheric CO2 while helping elephants. See this Ted talk to understand how:

https://www.ted.com/talks/allan_savory_how_to_green_the_worl...

hockeybias: you are shadowbanned and have been for the last 5 years

Wow, that's awful. Shouldn't this stuff have an expiry timer by default? :(

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