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Comment by izolate | Hacker News Reader

As a non Uber customer, why would I use this over Hailo? And why would Uber customers opt for a more expensive taxi when the same application has a cheaper option?

When I use black cabs here in London, I'd much rather use an established and local product from a company with less questionable ethics. That's Hailo.

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My guess is it's more about politics than actual service. Basically saying "hey, taxis are so much different we can even offer them as a completely separate service. UberX / Uber are not taxis." This may come useful if/when TfL changes their mind, or some court forces this discussion.

To me, it sends the opposite message actually that Uber pretty much is the same as a taxi; they can incorporate taxis into uber in a way that works pretty much the same for the end-user (but with regulated rates).

With legal threats to their attempts to make an end-run around taxi regulation, it makes sense they are trying to diversify and have an income stream via regulated taxis as well.

> ...from a company with less questionable ethics

Ok, I'll bite. What is questionable about Uber's ethics?

Things like its "Safe Rides Fee": http://valleywag.gawker.com/why-is-uber-charging-you-extra-t...

And questionable promotions: http://valleywag.gawker.com/uber-used-the-boston-bombing-ann...

And [allegedly] intentionally triggering surge pricing: http://www.thewire.com/technology/2014/02/uber-busted-intent...

And otherwise just acting as if the rules just don't apply to them: http://www.straight.com/news/uber-town-car-service-shut-down...

We may not like fees and the Boston promo may be tasteless but they aren't unethical.

I don't see a problem with surge pricing. If people aren't willing to pay then it won't last long. I'd like to see them have a bidding system to make it purely market driven.

I also don't see anything unethical with fighting unethical laws. Here in Austin we're in a very similar situation. The existing transportation companies have passed laws to entrench their positions and eliminate competition (eg min "black car" fares). Those laws are unethical. They do not protect us, they are anti-consumer.

Oh, you know, just a few things:

http://valleywag.gawker.com/uber-used-the-boston-bombing-ann...

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/03/28/uber-s-bigg...

http://pando.com/2012/10/24/travis-shrugged/

http://www.nbcchicago.com/investigations/Ride-Service-May-Po...

http://pando.com/2014/04/24/uberx-allegedly-hired-a-convicte...

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Uber-sued-over-girl-s-...

They are shifting all of the liability to the people who can least afford it. So far they have done everything in their power to not protect drivers like in the case last month. http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Uber-denies-fault-in-S... An uber driver killed a girl, but Uber is claiming they are not liable because he did not have an active fare at the time. It is unlikely this driver can ever make the family whole.

Additionally many car sharing services are operating without regard to the law. In some states the cars are getting seized. So far Uber has been covering the legal case, but they have no obligation to continue to do so.

Not to say that Uber does not have questionable ethics, but I think your two examples are wrong. Uber is now insuring their drivers as long as they are logged into the app. http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/14/5508568/uber-expands-drive...

The car seizure you reference was in Belgium for a service that technically complies with local laws according to Uber and they are providing legal assistance to the two owners of the seized cars. http://tech.eu/news/screw-innovation-uber-already-deemed-ill...

You mention that so far Uber is covering the legal costs without an obligation to do so. So that makes them bad?

So Uber is saying their insurance will cover 125k? This is not an adequate amount of coverage, and they are still shifting any liability away from the company, onto people who cannot afford the consequences. Who pays in a tragedy like this?

There have been many car seizures in the US and abroad. Many of these independent contractors do not have the resources to fight a legal battle without the help of Uber.

On top of what others have mentioned, Uber has also been caught sabotaging competing car services by ordering their cars and canceling them as a physical denial of service attack against the other company.

They didn't even apologize for that one, only stating that the marketing team was "overzealous". As far as anyone is aware nobody was reprimanded in any way over this debacle, which is par for the course as far as Uber goes.

Uber the product is great, Uber the company is shady as all get out. This is why I don't trust them to shape regulation any more than I trust the existing taxi lobby. They're all purely self-serving and anti-consumer when they think they can get away with it.

http://money.cnn.com/2014/01/24/technology/social/uber-gett/

insurance situation is still quite ambiguous; also no phone number - even for emergencies. Get into a worst case scenario accident, and a passenger dies in your Uber? Sorry no phone number, send an email with details and pics.

I didn't know Halio was London based I swear by Uber in Toronto and will use it in London when I'm there next. A long time ago (year and half?) I looked up what the difference between the two was and it wasn't much. Comparing apples to apples, namely, plain old taxi service, they aren't much different but Uber is straight no minimums, gratuity set to a standard rate. I decided not try Halio at the time and stick with the Uber I'd been supporting (arbitrary I know) and enjoy not having to worry about any settings or anything. Hail cab, hop in, hop out, done.

On the business side I think Halio is an actual cab dispatcher company, whereas Uber is just an app service that any cabbie can use..... Anyways, yeah, have nothing but good things to say about Uber and kind of laugh at the mess going on in London right now

One of the main benefits over Hailo is that it doesn't appear to have Hailo's minimum pricing: https://hailocab.com/drivers/blog/2013/02/04/minimum-fares-s...

I imagine it will also have different drivers, so it may be worthwhile having both apps. I often find myself with a 10 minute wait for Uber when a Hailo taxi is 2 minutes away, and vice-versa.

> When I use black cabs here in London, I'd much rather use an established and local product from a company with less questionable ethics. That's Hailo.

What!? Hailo now does private cab hire firm booking, which led to lots of Black cab drivers removing support for it

So why is it bad for Hailo to do private cab hire booking?

Because before Hailo (set up by a former black cab driver) was previously only for Black Cabs. It isn't bad, unless you are a black cab driver. Metering would work differently than with private hire cabs too (cheaper)

He may be referring to this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7115177

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