Perhaps you have some facts to support the Australian argument; but generally older tech is supported and propped up by entrenched interests, focused on their own profit margins, public good be damned.
> seem like someone who wants to point out that running copper is
> like hanging dollar bills because, you know, the Poors.
I have never seen a civil society / NGO telecom development project that did not rule out running copper in an impoverished country with a weak government. Have you? The problem is not "the poors." The problem is a failed economy and no rule of law.
You obviously have no clue about the real happenings of Somalia. The standards of living, core metrics like life expectancy, all of them really except school enrollment, have increased despite being anarchic for the last 20+ years. In comparison to neighbors like Ethiopia, Somalia is doing well. If you look at mobile adoption and access to tech, the improvement in Somalia outshadows most other African countries.
There is the rule of law where Xeer is used. Xeer is suppressed only in the area of the south where war is being waged between UN insurgents and al-Shabaab fighters. The rest of the country beyond Galkayo (Puntland and Somaliland) is not a "failed economy" by any measure besides the faulty assumption that an economy requires strict intervention in a western-progressive style.
> The standards of living, core metrics like life expectancy, all of
> them really except school enrollment, have increased despite being
> anarchic for the last 20+ years.
I am genuinely interested in seeing these statistics because the picture you paint of Somalia is much rosier than the picture painted by the people at the Somali-Bantu Community Center in my county. I am trying to keep an open mind but I have to admit my skepticism about the situation in somalia meant that I read your comment as:
"All of the core metrics [except education but everyone knows education is a useless metric for judging living conditions] in Somalia have increased [from zero] because it has been hellish in Somalia for twenty years.
There is a functioning economy and rule of law in Somalia [if you exclude the south where there is not a lot of positive things to talk about except that the government official targeted in yesterdays car bombing was not among the 11 people killed]."
My response to the rest is below ----
See Spencer Heath MacCallum's The Rule of Law without the State here: http://mises.org/daily/2701
>Imagine any part of the globe not being dominated by a central government and the people there surviving, even prospering. If such were to happen and the idea spread to other parts of Africa or other parts of the world, the mystique of the necessity of the state might be irreparably damaged, and many politicians and bureaucrats might find themselves walking about looking for work.
>If the expectation was that Somalia would plunge into an abyss of chaos, what is the reality? A number of recent studies address this question, including one by economist Peter Leeson drawing on statistical data from the United Nations Development Project, World Bank, CIA, and World Health Organization. Comparing the last five years under the central government (1985–1990) with the most recent five years of anarchy (2000–2005), Leeson finds these welfare changes:
- Life expectancy increased from 46 to 48.5 years. This is a poor expectancy as compared with developed countries. But in any measurement of welfare, what is important to observe is not where a population stands at a given time, but what is the trend. Is the trend positive, or is it the reverse?
- Number of one-year-olds fully immunized against measles rose from 30 to 40 percent.
- Number of physicians per 100,000 population rose from 3.4 to 4.
- Number of infants with low birth weight fell from 16 per thousand to 0.3 — almost none.
- Infant mortality per 1,000 births fell from 152 to 114.9.
- Maternal mortality per 100,000 births fell from 1,600 to 1,100.
- Percent of population with access to sanitation rose from 18 to 26.
- Percent of population with access to at least one health facility rose from 28 to 54.8.
- Percent of population in extreme poverty (i.e., less than $1 per day) fell from 60 to 43.2.
- Radios per thousand population rose from 4 to 98.5.
- Telephones per thousand population rose from 1.9 to 14.9.
- TVs per 1,000 population rose from 1.2 to 3.7.
- Fatalities due to measles fell from 8,000 to 5,600.
You can verify any of these statistics yourself through sources like the mentioned CIA Factbook: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/...
----
>I am genuinely interested in seeing these statistics because the picture you paint of Somalia is much rosier than the picture painted by the people at the Somali-Bantu Community Center in my county. I am trying to keep an open mind but I have to admit my skepticism about the situation in somalia meant that I read your comment as:
>"All of the core metrics [except education but everyone knows education is a useless metric for judging living conditions] in Somalia have increased [from zero] because it has been hellish in Somalia for twenty years.
>There is a functioning economy and rule of law in Somalia [if you exclude the south where there is not a lot of positive things to talk about except that the government official targeted in yesterdays car bombing was not among the 11 people killed]."
Bantu in Somalia are part of the chaotic southwest. The southwestern provinces such as Bay and Bakool have recently either declared autonomy from Mogadishu or have started to discuss it.
The port city of Kismayo had been a pivotal stronghold for al-Shabaab who held it for the past few years. Al-Shabaab has lost a ton of ground in the past year whereas it had controlled the majority of south Somalia for the three years or so prior.
There was a shit ton of military action and natural disasters such as the drought affecting this area, so certainly this part of the country is no utopia.
The other parts of the country is like another world. As al-Shabaab has lost ground in the south, they have moved some operations to the divided city of Galkayo. 1/3 of the city is controlled by the south and whatever Transitional Government is ruling now while the other 2/3 of the city is part of Puntland. This is about the extent of violence in Somalia. Coincidentally, the 2/3 of the geographical area of Somalia besides south of Galkayo.. the Horn and Somaliland, are relatively peaceful with only a dash of violence spreading from the UN conflict zone.
Education matters, I was just mentioning the truth that all metrics have improved besides schools. You can make of that what you want. There was no real widespread schooling system before and there isn't one still. The UN-backed Transitional Government is having a hard time keeping terrorist bombings out of Mogadishu, so it isn't anywhere near spreading schools around the country.
> verify any of these statistics yourself
- Physicians per 100,000:4 (this is tenth lowest and FYI the CIA uses per 1k)
- Infant mortality: 3rd highest 100 Afghanistan highest at 114.
- Maternal morbidity: 1,000 3rd behind South Sudan (2,000) and Chad (1,100)
- Sanitation Down to 23%
The article is using the following sources as mentioned therein: "statistical data from the United Nations Development Project, World Bank, CIA, and World Health Organization"
You obviously have some sort of state apologist agenda by your intellectually dishonest statements here.
If you are going to start spitting out statistics, you better provide a source as well.
"Physicians per 100,000:4 (this is tenth lowest and FYI the CIA uses per 1k)"
Where are you getting 4 per 100K from? The CIA factbook says 4 per 1,000.
"Infant mortality: 3rd highest 100 Afghanistan highest at 114."
"Maternal morbidity: 1,000 3rd behind South Sudan (2,000) and Chad (1,100)"
Meanwhile the the facts are: 'Infant mortality per 1,000 births fell from 152 to 114.9' and 'Maternal mortality per 100,000 births fell from 1,600 to 1,100'
The point is there was improvement, not that Somalia is a great place to live based on first-world country standards, so saying, "Oh that is still the 3rd worst in the world!" is utterly irrelevant.
"Sanitation Down to 23%"
After an increase in the period discussed, the first 5 years of anarchy. The CIA Factbook currently says 23.6% for improved sanitation facilities, versus 26% mentioned in the article. Is this 3 percentage points of decrease that important?
The fact remains that things have generally gotten better for Somalia despite the terrible military and economic intervention.
>> "Physicians per 100k:4 (this is 10th lowest...)"
> Where are you getting 4 per 100K from?
> The CIA factbook says 4 per 1,000.
Or do you need a source for the math? I do not think converting 0.04/1,000 to 4/100,000 is part of the proprietary math instruction I received at the state-apologist reeducation camp.
> "Infant mortality: 3rd highest 100 ...
> "Maternal morbidity: 1,000 3rd behind South Sudan...
> "Sanitation Down to 23%"
> The CIA Factbook currently says 23.6% for improved
> sanitation facilities, versus 26% mentioned in the
> article. Is this 3 percentage points of decrease that
> important?
> Meanwhile the the facts are: 'Infant mortality per 1,000 births fell from 152 to 114.9' and 'Maternal mortality per 100,000 births fell from 1,600 to 1,100'
Everybody's stats for this fell: http://web.archive.org/web/20091028133430/https://www.cia.go...
> The point is there was improvement, not that Somalia
> is a great place to live based on first-world country
> standards, so saying, "Oh that is still the 3rd worst
> in the world!" is utterly irrelevant.
Now in power, they've realised what a stupid platform they've run on, since anything they do is breaking a "we won't do that" promise they made earlier. Abandoning the NBN is a relatively minor pledge that they can keep so it doesn't look like a total rout. Their Communications minister certainly doesn't give the impression that he thinks it's the right thing to do.