Comment by izacus | Hacker News Reader

Comment by izacus | Hacker News Reader

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After doing couple of Android projects with Gradle I've felt like Maven is a godsend.

It might require writing some XML to declare what your project does, but at least it WORKS and at least it does not waste my time by forcing me to write code to include pieces of projects and properly process project (e.g. including native code, Robolectric testing, renderscript and some other things).

Also any compilation inside IDE's was orders of magnitude faster with Mvn than with Gradle... all in all setting up all the components with gradle took about 2-3x as much time. Mostly it seems like someone decided that because now you have code instead of XML for build configuration, they'll just skip most of the plugin design and force you to roll half of the build process on your own.

Right now (at least for Android), Gradle is a colossal waste of time due to lacking features, extremely slow execution and myriad of bugs which will eat away productive time on project.

> Right now (at least for Android), Gradle is a colossal waste of time due to lacking features, extremely slow execution and myriad of bugs which will eat away productive time on project

Are the sparse features, slow executes, and bugginess due to Gradle or due to the scripting language it uses? www.gradle.org/overview says they will happily support any community effort to create additional build script engines for Gradle. The Gradle developers had better do it themselves because after the Groovy++ fiasco, noone's going to put work into building something related to the Groovy ecosystem when it's likely to be skuttled and/or stolen later on.

From the usual JUG discussion themes I also get the impression, if it wasn't for Gradle, the Groovy interest would be much lower nowadays.

There was a Grails wave here in Germany, but now I seldom see anything related to it.

Yesterday's Who is hiring? (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7679431) only had 1 mention of Groovy or Grails (and none of Gradle) out of over 400 comments. And many (most?) of the projects tagged Groovy on Github are triggered by a single Gradle build script for a project that uses some other language. These Gradle build scripts are often 30 lines long.

So I'm not sure how Groovy will fare in the future. Nothing seems to be taking its place, though, for testing and general manipulation of Java classes. Java and Scala are statically-compiled languages for building things, whereas dynamic Clojure seems to also be used for systems programming rather than scripting. I'm guessing Oracle will heavily promote Nashorn for scripting and JavaFX, but Javascript syntax doesn't seem quite as full-featured as Groovy for now.

I seldom used it.

Back in 2009 there was a big Grails wave here in Germany. Many JUGs had Groovy and Grails talks.

There was also some people trying to use Groovy with JSF. Myself I attended a session promoted by Sun hitting at possible official support after the JSF 2.0 release.

To the point we added support to it in our in-house JSF framework SDK, still JSF 1.x based.

Since late 2010 I have been doing .NET land mostly and now back on Java land, I hardly see any Groovy besides Gradle.

I think it's just mostly the fact that tools aren't complete: e.g. IDEs will parse Maven pom.xml and use internal builders to speed up compilation while when using Gradle you're always spawning the external builder.

Same goes with other things: we had to write Groovy code to handle build cases which Maven plugins handle by default. That's mostly an ecosystem issue.

for normal dependency management you shouldn't need to write code. I've never done any android dev, so I can't comment on that. declaring a dependency is literally like this:

dependencies { compile group: 'commons-collections', name: 'commons-collections', version: '3.2' testCompile group: 'junit', name: 'junit', version: '4.+' }

But I am not going to be the great gradle defender :) I have many complaints..... I would have much preferred that Rake became the default build system for java. Sadly that approach never took off....

Yeah, for normal dependencies that's true. But on Android you quickly get some additional things that have to be handled by the build system:

* Code generation from annotations (reflection on Android is slow, so doing code generation is way better) * Attaching native .so libraries in proper directories of APK (Maven plugin does that automatically, Gradle needed writing code for that to work) * Properly handling RenderScript backwards compatibility library (there was no Gradle support for that at all)

* Testing - Robolectric is still not supported which throws a wrench into whole Jenkins/TeamCity autotest stack and needs fiddling with emulators

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