Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest | Hacker News Reader

Uber – London Tube Strikes or How to take advantage of a protest

blog.uber.com

42 pointspablisco50 comments

I can see it now: Londoners huddled outside of the barred-up tube entrances in the rain, moaning privately to themselves about the lack of transportation, until one clever sod whips out his smartphone and announces, "Uber will give us 50% off if we split!"

Dozens of commuters will scramble to share a cab with him as they excitedly scroll through the options for different drivers. "This one's only got four stars!" says one Uber virgin, shocked that anybody would consider less than five.

"Don't worry," says one of our Uber-savvy commuters, "they regularly prune the list of people who're getting poor reviews. I read it in an article on Hacker News."

"You read it on what news?" says another.

As the commuters split evenly into fairly sensible groups based on their desired destinations, the cars begin to arrive and they all pile in, leaving the pavement empty but for a busker and a Big Issue salesman.

As the final satisfying slam of an UberX car vibrates throughout the street, our new, friendly passengers get to know each other.

"This is rather nice, isn't it?"

"Pfft, who needs the underground?" says one, as they sit in gridlocked traffic on City Road, merely two hours from their destination, one-and-a-half miles away.

"Wait, what's surge pricing?" says one Uber virgin to the Uber-savvy commuter that packed them into the car.

"Oh, it means Uber can charge you whatever they want during peak times."

"But you said we were getting 50% off?"

"Oh but we are! 50% off the surge price."

"So if they put the surge price to 2x then we'd be paying the exact same amount we would anyway, and this promotion would be for nothing?"

"Well, yes. But I'm sure Uber would never do that. Uber is my best free-market friend!"

Of course they'd do that. But at the same time, realize that (a) all fixed-price transportation options will suffer from a shortage of some sort under the strike, be it bus or taxi or space-on-the-roads-in-general, (b) a lot of the higher prices go to pay the drivers, so that more drivers make an effort to work longer and harder to make extra money, (c) Uber's probably taking a loss on each discounted ride, and just hope to make it up with new customers and publicity.

This is, in fact, the free market at its best, and it's not the market's fault or Uber's fault if it's ugly out there. You always have the option not to use it and hail a taxi regularly. Good luck. You'll need it.

Even at normal times I've found it much quicker to walk than take a taxi. I've beaten colleagues to venues on multiple occasions.

I wish these cab apps would use their power to try to improve the air quality in London. Offering incentives to low emission vehicles or those with scrubbers. Or just giving users the choice.

BTW I made a really simple tube strike info site: http://www.isthetubeonstrike.com/

Oh hi James!

I agree, but to be fair they do at least use Priuses for UberX. In a gridlock, they'll probably be fairly harmless ;)

I actually have used UberX before in London, at a fairly quiet time but when I was in a rush and it was great. I'd recommend it for that kind of situation, especially if you're not in a taxi hunting ground.

I'll send you an email. :)

http://www.greentomatocars.com/uk/ look quite good. Not used them though.

I don't really understand why people would use Uber in London when services like Hailo exist. A black cab is going to get you around London much faster than a car that can't use bus lanes, there are many more cabs available than Uber cars, and I would guess (without knowing) that a cab is going to be cheaper.

So, apart from Uber maybe having some nicer cars available, what's the deal?

Black cabs generally require cash. Whilst they may advertise they take card, most drivers don't like it due to the lead time on getting the money through.

Hailo doesn't require cash, the card payment mechanism is incredibly seamless - you literally get out of the cab and carry on with your day. Also, about 13.000 London taxis are (apparently) signed up to Hailo.

Not to disagree with you but IMHO Hailo works fine and is totally cashless.

Hailo (and competitors) let you use cards, and the drivers seem pretty happy about it.

I'm referring to using Cabs direct. I realise Hailo is via card.

What happens when you get to your destination and hand over a card?

"Cash? Sorry, I've got no cash. Just this credit card."

uberX without surge pricing is cheaper than a black cab.

    > I don't really understand why people would use Uber in
    > London when services like Hailo exist

UberX is much cheaper, and if you want some luxury, Uber Lux is still pretty cheap. UbiCabs and Addison Lee are the real competitors (for my custom) - fixed-price quotes FTW.

It is cheaper, but I see your point.

There's something to be said for the Knowledge, which in case any readers here don't know, is what it sounds like. London Black Cab drivers have comprehensive knowledge of London's streets which allows them to get around very quickly compared to many minicab drivers including Uber cars. They have to have this to get their licence to drive a black cab.

Yeah and just as many of those cab drivers are prone to hectoring you when you tell them which way to go... especially when they take a longer route under the guise of it "being quicker." They're also completely reckless and drive like maniacs -- unless they have a passenger, in which case you'd think they were transporting Faberge eggs: coming to slow, rolling stops and being slow to catch green lights.

They're also prone to be "on their way home" and thus, "not going in the direction you're going" if you want to go some place that is unlikely to get them a fare back into central.

Any competition against these over-priced monopolists is a good thing in my book. Yes they have 'the knowledge' and yet I still find myself giving them directions to where I want to go.

(Still, they're better clued-in than a sketchy minicab driver; but then, that bar is set rather low.)

So:

- Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away)

- Cheaper (by a good margin)

- There are more than twice as many private hire cars than taxis in London - although, they're not all on Uber, by a huge margin. I "top up" with Kabbee when Uber falls short. (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachm...)

- Not too proud to use sat nav (A major selling point for taxis is that they have "The Knowledge" which, in a way, is impressive, but ragingly annoying when they don't happen to know the place you're going and you have to provide turn-by-turn navigation).

- Private hire cars don't have an industry association that calls the competition rapists (This weekend, Regent Street. On my way to grab an Uber. https://www.dropbox.com/s/2qqmy7sldbax6xk/20140426_232545.jp... )

- Nicer cars (I don't how that's an afterthought to be brushed away)

It isn't, but London cabs are far from uncomfortable, and most people don't have long journeys. It's factor, but I struggle to see it as an important one.

Private hire cars don't have an industry association that calls the competition rapists

That's not really calling the competition rapists. It's not even specifically talking about the competition you're talking about - the danger is unlicensed cabs and drivers who are not certified.

> It's not even specifically talking about the competition you're talking about - the danger is unlicensed cabs and drivers who are not certified.

The headline on the article says "minicabs" which is specifically the competition I'm talking about and whose drivers are licensed and certified.

This does not seem like a well-planned marketing campaign. Uber and its competitors would've done well enough on pure demand alone without having to say anything. But now they've decided to (inadvertently or not) jump into labor politics, which will almost certainly be interpreted as an effort to sap the strike of its power...and this effort will be associated particularly with the affluent who are wealthy enough to use Uber. I'm not saying the labor strike is right or wrong, I'm just saying that there is no way to stay out of the politics with this kind of marketing campaign, no matter its actual intentions. So I hope the contingency for blowback was planned out, and that this was not just the marketing department's way of riffing off of current events.

Talk about giving the London cabbies (who do have the ear of Bo Jo) a stick to beat uber with - yet another sv company with the political sense of a dead hedgehog in a paper bag.

Uber seems to like getting into politics.

I suspect they see the resulting press coverage as free advertising.

I hadn't realised they operated in London until this. However I'm now completely put off ever using them by the greedy opportunism here and recognise their name as some kind of creepy übermenschian far-right libertarian cultural import.

This isn't the first time Uber has scabbed during a transit strike. They're openly hostile toward organized labor.

It's not scabbing if it's a totally different service. Would a guy riding a pedicab be scabbing? Am I scabbing if I offer my neighbor a drive to work during a transit strike?

Erm.... keep London moving by putting even more cars on the road?

Because that's the problem, not enough affordable cars. That'll definitely work.

Keep London moving by providing a discount to put multiple people in each car. Far better.

SF startups disrupting working class demonstrations, that will go down well, you are fired pete.

I don't know if you're a Londoner, but for what it's worth, I think Uber's promotion (poorly conceived and worded as it is) won't be read that way in London. The tube workers are split between a number of unions, the TSSA, ASLEF and the RMT, of which only the RMT is participating in this latest strike (previous strikes this year have been cross-union). Also important to note is that the RMT had been led by Bob Crow for the past 12 years until he died suddenly in March. Under his leadership, the RMT was very aggressive with its strike action in comparison to the other unions, but that policy successfully boosted its tube driver members to an average salary of £52,000/pa ($87,400/pa). And even though he was a hate figure for much of the right-wing press during his lifetime, on his passing there was a consensus of sorts that he had been exceptionally good at his job and was actually well-regarded by his opposite numbers at Transport for London (who run the tube) as tough but a pragmatist.

This latest strike takes place in the shadow of the battle to succeed Bob Crow at the RMT. Tactically, it could undermine the union, as TfL will be able to keep a significant part of the network operational. However, none of the candidates for the leadership of the Union can oppose it for fear of being tarred as a management stooge by their rivals. Of course, that's not to say that both the TfL and even the other unions won't benefit if this strike proceeds and ends up being a damp squib.

All of which is to say, as working class demonstrations go, this one's something of an edge case. I'm pro organised labour but I think this particular strike is going to damage the cause more than it helps -- if the RMT is painted as reckless users of their strike power, the (right-of-centre) government will have an easier time either making it harder to strike (in terms of forcing minimum participation thresholds) or even the nuclear option of making the Tube an essential service, which would put its workers in the same position as the Police, Army and prison officers, who are legally barred from striking.

TfL has indicated that due to additional traffic, car journeys may take twice as long as usual (which is long enough) during the strike. I hope you like the people you're sharing with because if you do this during rush hour you will be spending a lot of time sitting next to them.

That's a pretty optimistic estimate. I cycle to work every day up the A24/A3 corridor and on the first day of the last strike it was the most ridiculous gridlock I've ever seen. I passed an ambulance that was locked in and no way to move even with vehicles trying to drive up on the pavement to let it through. The second day was better as people realized driving was not a solution, but my advice is to either cycle or stay home.

As someone who tried to drive to work during the last strike; you can literally walk faster than the traffic.

Overland trains, cycle, or walk.

There's no point driving, or being in any motor vehicle, tomorrow.

"We’re all in this together, so grab a friend and SPLIT!" Unless you're striking. In that case, Uber will not be with you. Uber will in fact be against you. What about when the strike is over. Well, Uber isn't really with you then either. Please see terms and conditions. We're all in this together "throughout the entire 48-hour strike until 6am on Thursday morning". Then, when unions have been busted and public infrastructure de-funded, you're on your own again.

The title needs fixed - it should be "#KEEPLONDONMOVING! 50% OFF ALL RIDES DURING THE TUBE STRIKE WHEN YOU FARE SPLIT"

(unless of course we are now allowing editorialising in HN post titles)

Uber, playing the valuable role of transit scabs.

Dear Uber, do you know how I will take advantage of the protest? I'll walk home, you can stay in as many traffic jam as you like

cheers

I am a huge fan of how easy it is to tell British writers on HN just by how dripping in irony everything is.

I'm really enjoying the posts on this article ... startup wankery meets the real life British commuter.

But... Uber insists that it needs surge pricing, otherwise drivers won't bother to give lifts. So a 50% off promotion must mean there won't be any drivers turning up to work, right?

Presumably Uber is paying the drivers the difference.

Presumably Uber will have a 4x surge during the strike.

They'd still have to pay the extra to drivers, and it would be larger than at 1x surge... unless their overhead is more than 50%?

Whenever I was stuck due to a tube strike there was nothing the bus or Addison Lee couldn't solve. I struggle to see Uber's "disruptive technology" work in London.

50% off the ride if you share the ride with another person, who pays the other 50%?....

If you haven't heard yet, Uber has recently raised it's fees on UberX drivers from 5% to 15%. At first, I was completely behind them, but they're turning into a pretty cut throat company.

As great as I'm sure this is, I think I will stick to my original plan: working from home.

SCABS

Scabs.

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