My First Year of Coding
blog.jenniferdewalt.com
blog.jenniferdewalt.com
In my mind I've sort of associated the brand "Jennifer Dewalt" with ambition, dedication and inspiration. I send your posts and websites to my sister to encourage her down a similar path. Keep up the great work! :)
To me this is not a story about programming or gender, it's a story about grit.
(I edited this to make it less harsh.)
The jokes thing is a tricky one for HN. I love comedy and I love wit. I'm sure most of us do. But when you're optimizing for signal/noise ratio, as HN tries to, there are tradeoffs. On the whole, I think the community habit of downvoting most (not all) jokes is reasonable for what HN is trying to be.
Responsive, built using Ruby on Rails, bootstrap, jquery, etc.
Any questions he had he could ask me and I would nudge him along, but it was 90% his determination that got him to where he's at now. Having a mentor helps. I hope at least someone is inspired by jennifer or my brother, it can be done and an insane amount of time! You just need the cojones.
Got fed up with that and finally bought a rubber ducky.
edit: Really? Could the downvoter explain to me what's wrong with this comment? Are we supposed to just leave banned accounts to rot now?
(and yes, I agree, it'd work even better without showdead.)
What's actually wrong with this persons activity here though - they're [presumably] new and haven't had chance to learn all about HN yet. Their questions/comments don't seem so terrible that they should be hellbanned, or do you disagree.
Presumably what you're saying here is that no-one should have the chance to warn those who're hellbanned, we should trust the secret machination of HN to always be right?
It's not that I agree or disagree with this particular banning, but that in the aggregate, "you are a new account and you post a link to youtube" is a pretty good general characteristic. While it's unfortunate that there's sometimes a false positive, most things that I see explicitly dead deserve to be.
Besides, it's pretty easy to figure out if you've been hellbanned, and then if you're real, you can ask dang (I guess, now, eh?) to reverse it. No warnings needed.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6097155
IMHO she deserves kudos not just for accomplishing her goal (which really is impressive enough on its own) but doing so in the face of a community with such deeply ingrained sexism that some people thought it "suspicious" at the outset.
Obviously she's a strong enough person that this kind of stuff didn't derail her project, but one can only imagine what a different world we'd be in if projects like these were met with more encouragement and less derision.
Not that the haters are getting any satisfaction today.
My criticism would be that in her post she highlights only the negative comments she got. When, on the whole, the community votes her posts up and the top comments are always positive.
This is above and beyond, the greatest lesson I've learned as an entrepreneur. Kudos to you Jennifer for finding the same.
That's because you aren't a software engineer, and if you are saying so then the feelings of being an impostor are entirely warranted.
'Coding' is one thing, 'engineering' is something different altogether.
I'm afraid this falls into the 'you don't know what you don't know category'.
and then there is also that bit about no such thing as a "software engineer" …
The differences betweem an architect and an civil engineer is the math.
Do you also think the difference between a doctor and a biomedical engineer is math?
P.S.: I agree with your first point, but the analogy you chose is really bad. Self-taught coder isn't to a software engineer what an architect is to a civil engineer.
At face value this assessment feels very unfair. Where do you draw the line? Experience -- is a year not enough? Deliverables -- is YumHacker not enough? Education -- is it lack of formal training that separates the engineer from the coder?
Is it the ability to build non-trivial software systems that makes a software engineer? And we should rely on whose definition of "non-trivial" to assess her engineering ability in that case?
I'm not saying you're wrong in stating she isn't a software engineer, but I doubt you possess the knowledge of her ability required to make such an assessment with any degree of validity.
Then I dug deeper in Javascript, reading every book I could find until I knew all the pitfalls of the language firstclass functions, global namespacing, scopes, etc...Still did not feel like an engineer.
Dug into Objective-C (that's right...I skipped C) and struggled for three months to build my first app and launch it in the App Store (mostly because re-wrote it over and over not understanding the Core Data model issues I was having. Was I an engineer yet...NOT.
That's right, I skipped C. So, I went back and got into the C book and everything I could find on design patterns, etc.
One year in, trying to really build an app that does not suck and really get close to the metal with some assembly (yes, I know, I have been working backwards!) And do I consider myself an engineer now...? Kind of. Not a good one if I am (despite being a "hellava engineer" graduate from GaTech).
I may not consider myself one for the rest of the year. But that's me. I wish I had her feel for what she is. She posted to HN and I didn't so I give her props for that.
I believe part of it is that the general age demographic here is pretty young, and a lot of people have not so much experience working across a range of projects with a large number of people.
A year does not an 'engineer' make, in any field. Why should it be different in the field of software? It's not.
It's definitely tough not having a mentor, and I struggled a bit for a couple months after classes trying to figure out what I should spend my time learning. I still struggle with it when working on personal projects and often worry I'm not doing things the "best" way.
I sometimes get overwhelmed because there's so much I don't know, and deep down I know I'll never be as good/desirable as someone with a CS degree. That being said, I'm very happy where I am and wouldn't change anything.
I stopped working to write this comment--that's how important it is to me that you know this is a belief that will only hold you back.
I could cite any one of thousands of articles that talk about dropouts who made it, but I suspect you know about those articles and it hasn't affected your belief.
So I'll just say this: If I had graduated with a degree, I would have never been able to bootstrap a tech company when I was 20 and sell it for over a million dollars when I was 26.
Don't look at yourself through the eyes of others, because you'll always find yourself wanting. I'm sitting here about to launch my new company (we're doing final testing of our new website right now.) I have no idea whether our site (which is kind of wacky) will convert. I don't know if we'll get any sales. And I've got everything riding on this company--I've put all my chips in.
There's enough in this world that will kick your ass. People haven't believed in my companies for the past 13 years I've been running them. People have laughed in my face, investors have turned me down over and over again, customers have quit, money has been lost (and, on a brighter note, much money has been made!)
Sometimes the only thing you can count on is your internal belief that you WILL make it, no matter what. That's what got me through my last company during its darkest hours. That's what's getting me through now. Enough people will throw shit in your face. Don't be one of them. You are better than that.
The world is full of possibilities. Don't count yourself out. Jennifer sure didn't. ;)
I mean the whole "-I've put all my chips in." burn the boats outlook.
I quit my job to work on my startup ideas but have difficulty throwing all my savings in. Wife & kids is my excuse.
Yep, it really is. Not only have I turned down several huge income opportunities to work on MarketVibe, but I'd also sell just about everything I have to see this product come to market. We have a true game-changer of a product, and it's something I really believe in. We also have the right team to build it--I'm a target customer for this product, which is one reason I know the market needs it so badly. And it's a nice money-maker (SaaS).
But yeah. If I had to sell my car tomorrow to finance the startup, I'd do it with zero second thoughts. I'm in this 100%. Otherwise, why run a startup at all?
but you seem to adding a dynamic conversion form too.
and props for having the balls to go all in. My argument is that all my savings and assets is not mine. I share it with my family. I can/should only risk my part of the savings/assets even though I have the right to act unilaterally.
Some of my problem is having a savings habit and not being a spendy type of guy. Its an asset as well as I need to learn to loosen up and spend on lot more needed stuff to make our carrotleads product a success.
Please hit us up when you launch (or contact me personally if you don't want to post it yourself).
Thanks!
Edit: Cool, didn't realize you're in Austin! Gonna ping you
To me, that's the difference between a developer and a programmer. A programmer might write technically better code, but often gets stuck when something does not work as intended as is often the case in web browsers. A developer will find a way to make it work, and make it work well for the user.
So don't sell yourself short and keep on learning. You may in fact be more desirable than somebody with a CS degree.
I bet they all wish they knew more than they do... and work at removing that lack of knowledge for themselves.
I am a big fan of education, even of the CS variety, but a degree is one way to get an education, not the only way. And 'change the world' isn't in the textbooks.
If you keep going, there will be a point where you'll be excited to know that you always have more to learn.
Try to find a senior engineer who can mentor you if possible, and ask other engineers to do code reviews of your pull requests (the criticism is invaluable as long as you're humble and welcome it).
Additionally, engineering is more than just knowing algorithms and syntax and design patterns. A lot of the really important lessons (how to talk to non-technical people, how to push back on requirements, how to prioritize issues) are things that only come with professional experience and really can't be taught in a classroom. In that regard, you're on a level playing field with people who have a CS degree.
Your most likely practical problem, if you don't have another STEM degree, would be math-related. Self-study or just taking individual classes can fix that, but honestly, the vast majority of development work these days doesn't care about anything past basic algebra, if even that.
Many years ago (Makes me sound old...) I dropped out of a CS degree to pursue archaeology, and then dropped out of that when I ran out of money and needed a job...
That job (and all the subsequent jobs) taught me a lot about people and business, and trained me with the discipline to finish jobs by deadlines, work with the people around you, remain calm under pressure (most of the time...) etc. All of the time I was working I was training myself. I bought O'Reilly books on algorithms, read RFC's, specs, source code and anything else curiosity led me to.
Recently I left a position, and had to interview, choose and train my replacement. The person who got the job wasn't the most qualified. On paper, they only had half of the job requirements, but during the interview process I realized that this person learnt quickly. This person picked up new concepts, procedures and entirely new skill sets during the 3 weeks of one-on-one training, and they're still doing well in the position from all accounts.
What I'm getting at is that, although "safe" hiring practice is to pick people with CS degrees, there are many people out there who recognize learning ability, passion and personal motivation to be sometimes more important.
Don't lose hope, be confident, be honest, and don't stop learning.
When I look at it, I see a cloud full of rain. The rain drops fall on the earth and water a seed that grows into a sapling, then into a large strong tree. After that, the tree is cut down and becomes paper. So when I hold my college degree, I'm holding a cloud, some rain drops and lot's of sunshine. That's all.
What you've accomplished is extremely impressive and serves as a shining example of how someone can go from knowing morning to developing a true skill. Job well done!
Also, how did the project work out time-wise? Were you working at the same time? Roughly how long did you spend on each site?
Keep up the good work!
I quit my job last year and have been working on the 180 websites project and now YumHacker full time. I spent on average 10 hours a day on the 180 project.
Making myself publicly accountable was definitely a great motivator but my biggest take away was getting over the fear of being wrong/judged.
They have got C++ & Unix books on their shelves but as far as I can tell, it hardly been read.
Hoping your story gets the ball rolling.
As of now they know only the basics of markup language.
in terms of the learning curve this can be pulled off by an above avg 13 year old in 2 weeks....
Nonetheless women + coding or women + investment banking etc. is the magic combo that will put you on the front page in these days. talk about gender equality/survival of the fittest....lol
BUT I'd bet she's a better "coder" than me. She will be rock solid on all the basics, so she has a great base to do more complicated things. For the more complicated things I've done, I was relying heavily on stackoverflow searched and the like, and although I made complicated things that worked, they were probably fairly basic mistakes and things that could cause future problems that Jen wouldn't have made/done.
Too many people these days (me among them) jump in without knowing how to swim and then struggle to stay afloat. Jen taught herself to swim first.
As it is, I'm comfortable using the term to denote any activity that programmatically and logically instructs a computer to take a certain sequence of actions. C? Coding! Java? Coding! JavaScript? Coding! CSS? Coding! Excel columns? Coding! Ctrl-h and a regex selector? Coding! It's coding all the way down!
But I find this ridiculous. This is called learning and is done by thousandth/millions others. Everyone has to overcome their fear of being judged and stuff. Giving kudos just because of gender just undermines girls to take on harder challenges in future.
I started coding professionally when I was 17 not to starve, while overcoming depression and mental illness. My cousin started coding recently, he was born without hands! Nobody gives a shit because we are men.
- Any sort of criticism is down-voted to hell, this never happens when author is a boy
- and finally show me similar toy project from boy, which would make into front page of Hacker News.
-How many newbie type projects do we get? Are we downvoting criticisms because of gender or experience?
-Show me a similar project from a boy that didn't.
I have problem with comments here. Nobody offers any sort of constructive criticism. We should review source code and give her some advice. Perhaps recommend a new framework to use, or even completely new direction (NodeJS).
I think boys deserve bit more encouragement and girls deserve bit more honest constructive criticism.
If there _is_ any pussy-footing here (er, no pun intended) and I in no way am acknowledging that there is, it is in reaction to the extreme chauvinism of coders like you.
Kind of. I see lot of endorsements, but no evidence that someone actually read her code. There is also nobody who followed her on daily basis, since her announcement year ago.
You do not understand my basic complain. I do not mind girls get special treatment (not that she would need it). I mind that boys do not get the same special treatment.
There is a huge shortage of developers, but I only see helping programs to encourage GIRLS coding. There are FEMALE only internships and so on. Men are only 38% of college graduates.
Now when men learns to code by himself despite education system, he is called chauvinism because he is proud of his achievements.
I see now that I'm speaking to one of those men's rights nutballs. Open your mind and try to see from another person's point of view. Our conversation is finished.
As have we all. It makes me cringe thinking about it!
I doubt you'll get banned.
Your intuition is better than most; that comment has been punished enough. Things go much better when the community corrects things itself without moderators intervening. My goal is never to have to do anything. Edit: My long-term goal. :)